Hard News by Russell Brown

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Hard News: Some Lines for Labour

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  • Sofie Bribiesca, in reply to David Hood,

    :) Xlint.

    here and there. • Since Nov 2007 • 6796 posts Report Reply

  • B Jones,

    This is very very pretty and useful, and may have already been posted somewhere here:
    http://www.informationisbeautiful.net/play/snake-oil-supplements/

    Wellington • Since Nov 2006 • 976 posts Report Reply

  • Sofie Bribiesca,

    Also, I like bits of the Greens. I like bits of Labour.None are perfect. I think together we get a pretty good mix to the left. Don't mind that ,glad we got MMP.To have to choose between that and a mix of National, Act, with kiss arse Maori Party and Peter Dunne. I know where I lean.
    Srsly.

    here and there. • Since Nov 2007 • 6796 posts Report Reply

  • Islander, in reply to B Jones,

    Havent seen it before - a goodie-

    Big O, Mahitahi, Te Wahi … • Since Feb 2007 • 5643 posts Report Reply

  • Dave Waugh, in reply to Russell Brown,

    Meanwhile, Don Brash's open letter to John key might be the most socially divisive rant I've ever seen from a New Zealand political leader. Winston Peters included.

    It's bizarre.

    I refer you to item 6.......
    http://www.imperatorfish.com/2011/04/what-next-for-don-brash.html

    Wellington • Since Nov 2006 • 98 posts Report Reply

  • Idiot Savant, in reply to Che Tibby,

    once they ditch The Kedge they could be very respectable

    She's retiring at the election.

    Palmerston North • Since Nov 2006 • 1717 posts Report Reply

  • JLM, in reply to Rich of Observationz,

    I’d suggest the view of the less-hippy Greens (and of many doctors) is that if people want to indulge in quackery and it makes them happy, they should do so.

    I've sat in on lectures and demonstrations where a much respected and strongly research based oncologist has said that to a class of medical students (without using the word quackery, and stressing how essential it is that medical staff know exactly what is being ingested/undertaken). Which makes some level of integration, if not funding, worth investigating.

    Judy Martin's southern sl… • Since Apr 2007 • 241 posts Report Reply

  • JLM, in reply to Bart Janssen,

    Agreed Rich. Pharmac has been one of the most powerful tools for optimising the use of money in health care and screwing those folks over the way National did simply to buy votes was despicable.

    I know someone who voted National because of that policy, in tears because she was a life-long Labour voter, and yes, it was despicable.

    Judy Martin's southern sl… • Since Apr 2007 • 241 posts Report Reply

  • B Jones,

    It's one thing to let your patients do coffee enemas or whatever floats their boat, because you'd rather they do that than ditch you and run off to a clinic in Mexico; it's another to treat unproven medicine as equivalently deserving of the status of proven medicine, or funding it accordingly.

    Wellington • Since Nov 2006 • 976 posts Report Reply

  • Bart Janssen, in reply to B Jones,

    Close but not quite right. You just need to expand your sample size to the point where you get statistically significant data. Often the biggest problem I have with alternative medicine is n = 1.

    When you get significant data it stops being alternative and becomes part of the establishment. What is interesting is that at that point many adherents move onto something else.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 4461 posts Report Reply

  • Bart Janssen, in reply to Sofie Bribiesca,

    If magnets worked that way then MRIs would kill you - very very messily. If they work it is some other mechanism.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 4461 posts Report Reply

  • Bart Janssen, in reply to Sofie Bribiesca,

    But Sofie I want a perfect politician :)

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 4461 posts Report Reply

  • JLM, in reply to B Jones,

    True, not that I think that snippet of GP policy does that.

    Like James, I'm a member, and I'm thinking of putting up a workshop at the next policy conference with the proposition that "evidence-based policy" becomes a fifth principle. That should generate a good discussion!

    I see Tim Watkin is mulling over similar themes at Pundit. It would be interesting to have a reality-based scale for all the political parties.

    Judy Martin's southern sl… • Since Apr 2007 • 241 posts Report Reply

  • Islander, in reply to Bart Janssen,

    Not being rude to anyone (my long-dead but still-loved Nanna believed in her magnetic bracelet for diminishing the effects of her - very severe- osteo AND rheumatoid arthritis) but I would still suggest the "some other mechanism" is either
    a)belief, or
    b)given the fact that we are a relatively huge(in numbers) species, individual variant reactions. As Sofie said, "Different strokes for different folks."

    Big O, Mahitahi, Te Wahi … • Since Feb 2007 • 5643 posts Report Reply

  • James Butler, in reply to JLM,

    Like James, I’m a member, and I’m thinking of putting up a workshop at the next policy conference with the proposition that “evidence-based policy” becomes a fifth principle. That should generate a good discussion!

    Ooh please do. It'll be one more excuse for me to go.

    Auckland • Since Jan 2009 • 856 posts Report Reply

  • B Jones,

    If you're making a claim at a population level you need a proper sample size. But mostly what fans of alt med say is that it works "for them". If you want to know if it really works for you, it's not hard to test if you blind yourself somehow. Whereas you might discount someone else's result as being a function of their different physiology, disbelief, whatever, even if the sample is huge. We all know people who react to real meds differently, and they're well tested.

    Of course, once you've spent money on a product and taken it home, there's not much point in finding out it's ineffective - other people's data is useful to see whether you should take the risk in spending money.

    I recently read a theory that alt-med and anti-vaccination etc is more of a thing for lefties than righties because of its relationship to power - ignoring medical advice is sticking it to The Man. Whereas righties like the pseudoscience that supports powerful interests - creationism, climate change denial, etc. It's plausible.

    Wellington • Since Nov 2006 • 976 posts Report Reply

  • bmk,

    I simply find it puzzling ( and slightly saddening) how otherwise intelligent people can fall for obvious snake oil. A fellow third-year student, in the IS degree I am doing, has taken to wearing one of those silicone bracelet things.

    I politely asked him if he found it beneficial and he said that it had made a huge difference to him. When I asked him (once again politely) in what way did it help he couldn’t give one specific example of a benefit and said something along the lines of ‘just in general I guess’. He then recommended to me that I get one. And all this from a guy who is in nearly every other way smart.

    Since Jun 2010 • 327 posts Report Reply

  • James Butler, in reply to JLM,

    It would be interesting to have a reality-based scale for all the political parties.

    Of course, reality has a well-known liberal bias.

    Auckland • Since Jan 2009 • 856 posts Report Reply

  • Islander, in reply to B Jones,

    One of the things I did, before buying into the omega3/6 & chrondroitin ...shall we say, experiment?
    was to practise on myself.
    When the family curse (osteo) first occurred, I realised that
    a)being of Scots descent
    b)being of Southern Maori descent and
    c)especially having broken many bones during my life to date
    I needed to do something.
    Other than whimper, that is.
    I knew about
    *Kruschen salts (sp.)
    *cider vinegar & honey (really good as a salad dressing! still use it.)
    *capisum (sp.) based irritants
    -

    tried all those.
    Useless.
    And the others mentioned aforehand.

    What works (to date) for me (to date) are the food-based extracts (or, in the case of titi, the whole fking carcass!)

    What I have done: spend 3 months taking NO omega 3/chrondoitin. (And, no titi!)
    Spend 3 months taking omega 3.
    Spend 3 months taking chrondoitrin solus.
    The rest of the year, taking a combination of o/3/& mussel extract.

    I have a grossly deformed little finger joint, and thumb joint. I still have y'know, pain & stuff in the broken bits, but I am getting back to walking around properly. Without a stick necessary. Next: fishing again!

    Big O, Mahitahi, Te Wahi … • Since Feb 2007 • 5643 posts Report Reply

  • Carol Stewart, in reply to Bart Janssen,

    I know someone who keeps magnets down her undies to stave off menopause symptoms. True story.

    Wellington • Since Jul 2008 • 830 posts Report Reply

  • Islander, in reply to Carol Stewart,

    One of my midwife sisters once had a (very young) client who believed stuffing garlic cloves into her ears prevented pregnancy...

    Big O, Mahitahi, Te Wahi … • Since Feb 2007 • 5643 posts Report Reply

  • Carol Stewart, in reply to Islander,

    Stuffed them into her what?

    Wellington • Since Jul 2008 • 830 posts Report Reply

  • Islander, in reply to Carol Stewart,

    ears-
    my sister couldnt quite comprehend any damn thing about that either
    (and, obviously, the girl was still pregnant. O, birthing


    That actually was bettered in my sisters' experience by both of them having - many years separated - 2 clients who assumed - goodness! whatever happened to good lessons on sexual anatomy & sexual behaviours??? you could impregnate via the female urethal opening?

    Big O, Mahitahi, Te Wahi … • Since Feb 2007 • 5643 posts Report Reply

  • B Jones,

    You'd think somewhere else might be more effective. But only marginally.

    Wellington • Since Nov 2006 • 976 posts Report Reply

  • Islander, in reply to B Jones,

    I have learned SO much from my sisters! (O, and brothers. but that's stories other-)

    Personally, I cant imagine a more ineffective use of a garlic clove...

    Big O, Mahitahi, Te Wahi … • Since Feb 2007 • 5643 posts Report Reply

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