Hard News: Stop the Enabling
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Have a listen to the audio on the link below your posted quote.
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seven if you count the police "witness".
Why the quote marks, Dave?
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Dave, I've listened to the audio.
When the Yes Vote spokesperson mentioned that the law had passed its first test, it was after mentioning that some people might have thought that punching was reasonable force. Her choice of words may have been unwise, but she did not say that Mason would have been acquitted under the old law. Nor did she say the case was all about section 59.
Also look at the Yes Vote website, including the quote I referred to above.
Compare this with Family First's McCoskrie before the trial, who expressly linked it to the new law:
I think everybody has been waiting for a case like this to go before a judge so we can get a new interpretation of the law. It's an uncertain law, which is the worst part of it. Some say it totally bans smacking and some say it doesn't
And then Famly First issued a press release to further push its anti-section 59 agenda.
You really want to compare Family First with the Yes Vote?
You said:
I don't really think that groups like Family First and For the Sake of our Children - whom RB opposes - are "enabling" abuse
Here's McCoskrie again, before the court case:
Family First national director Bob McCoskrie was astounded to be told Mason had been charged. "That's amazing," he said.
And that attitude isn't enabling abuse?
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Russell, as you pointed out in your dishonest personal attack on me I once voted for Labour. Fortunately as most people mature to where they accept that other people have the right to hold views other than themselves. I was most impressed to see the Letter to the Editor by Dr Brian Edward’s condemning the students’ abuse of Melissa Lee. Brian Edwards is a bit older than you so I guess there is hope for you yet.
I do not share David Farrar’s Libertarian view on many matters relating to homosexuality. Nonetheless we can have discussion over drink and agree to disagree and discuss other matters. I have also shared a drink with Lindsay Perigo. His knows my views on militant homosexual activists. He agrees with me on a number of points. Not all homosexuals think the same way. Some opposed the Civil Unions legislation. This upsets some left wing homosexuals to the extent that they threaten to OUT them for not towing the party line.
I will get back to the topic of parental rights which you diverted from to launch a personal attack. My view on corporal punishment is not extreme. Eighty percent of the voters opposed the law change. I collected signatures at tables on the footpath, at sporting events and door to door. Some just signed while others expressed their reasons for opposing the law change. They came from all backgrounds and races. Many who signed would have been traditional Labour voters. These peasants that the militant Left are meant to represent are a lot more intelligent than you give them credit for. They know the difference between a smack on the legs and a punch to the head.
Very few if anyone would agree that a punch to the head is acceptable. That includes me, Bob McCroskie and others who you vilify and slander. I stated on your blog that if I have the opportunity to make another submission on this legislation I would recommend that hits, slaps or clips to the ear be banned. That does not stop others with your encouragement claiming that I condone a light punch to the head. This is a lie.
I am a member of the ACT Party. Many in the ACT Party follow a Libertarian line particularly on matters homosexual. I take a more conservative line and oppose such things as homosexual adoption. To many on the Left that makes me a homophobe. Many in the ACT Party including some homosexuals know my views but are able to carry on a discussion without personal abuse. Adults know how to agree to disagree and do not drag something up someone said three years ago on an unrelated matter.
You stated my age on your blog. That is not a problem. Why not tell us your age and when you think you will act your age. At least the university students have an excuse for drowning out Melissa Lee.
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But you've just linked to a report that says "The incident was witnessed by a school teacher and an off-duty police officer who reported it to police.
It's not really that hard. The schoolteacher and her teenage son saw Mason punch his son in the face. The schoolteacher called over the officer, to whom Mason readily admitted hitting his son. The officer called some other officers, presumably because Mason was continuing to nut off in the public street. The police also wanted to determine whether it was safe to sent Mason home with his kids.
The "incident" clearly went on for a while.
I'm not muttering, or providing a distraction for what happened, because I believe Mason could have been charged with assault for what he did a lot earlier than he was, as opposed for police to initially treat it as a S59 discretion case.
Like various others here, I don't really see your point.
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I am a member of the ACT Party.
Heh.
You stated my age on your blog. That is not a problem. Why not tell us your age and when you think you will act your age. At least the university students have an excuse for drowning out Melissa Lee.
Chuck, that was a news story from the TVNZ website. Although I have, it is true, described you as a "public fool". I see no reason to revisit that judgement.
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@Chuck
That does not stop others with your encouragement claiming that I condone a light punch to the head. This is a lie.
Horrors. How could anyone read the following paragraph from you and think that?
It is possible that the jury believed that Mason punched his boy lightly in the face. It is possible that the jury did not accept that Mason punched his boy lightly in the face yet correctly under this legislation found him guilt of assault. Pulling someone by the hair is assault.
Go away Chuck.
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. . . they threaten to OUT them for not towing the party line.
Eggcorn of the week.
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I am a member of the ACT Party.
I would never have guessed.
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dem eggs is broke
...the Um Louts have
taken over the asylum...Eggcorn of the week.
Joe - mine eyes have seeen the glory
I may never post again...sob
yrs
Mal Improper
ex-poofreader -
Y'know Ian, I don't recall any political party mobile billboards during the last election - but then I wasn't paying a lot of attention. If there were, thanks to Chuckie's revelation one can fairly bet that they were towed by closet homosexuals who'd undergo almost any humiliation to avoid being outed.
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Only one person around these parts introduced the concept of "light punching". Look in the mirror, Chuck, and wonder why others see you as a fool.
Believe whatever you like but don't expect others to politely agree to disagree every time when you publicly challenge some of their core beliefs or characteristics of their being. There's a big difference between a one-on-one conversation and blurting your prejudices for all to read.
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But I think it's unfair to focus on mis-using a word that has met a similar fate from others recently. The intent was clear, and it's a red herring. There's more than enough to find disagreeable without resorting to spelling or grammar.
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Go away Chuck.
I second that.
Chuck, you complain about the personal abuse directed against you here, but the moment you joined this discussion you started to throw insults. You're still making a complete fool of yourself by railing agaiinst the "Left" and all its supposed evils.
I for one don't care if you're feeling victimised by our insults. You lost all right to play the victim when you helped Wishart smear Peter Davis.
And finally, there are some music videos in this PA post you should watch. Please take the messages in them to heart.
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Like others, I would like to know what a 'light punch' from the fist of a grown man, to the face of a four year old, might be.
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There's more than enough to find disagreeable without resorting to spelling or grammar.t
Y'know sacha, if it weren't for that Fine Mind of yours, I might never have noticed.
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Fair enough. Where's that sarcasm tag when we need one?
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Is that a polite invite to join the United Front Against Smelly Old Misanthropes, then?
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Russell, you are very good at quoting out context. Below is an extract from another post of mine. It should be clear that I did not and do not condone a punch to the head light or otherwise. The point I was making was that a hard or even moderate punch would likely leave marks. You have misconstrued my position as you have done with Bob McCroskie.
Posted at 11:43AM on 22 May 09. Report. Permalink.
Where we do agree is if the incident was reported correctly is that Mason needs to learn some better parenting skills. There is no excuse for a parent to be using foul language as reported on your blog. If a parent has lost control they should not be using physical discipline for the purpose of correction. If Boscawen’s bill is drawn and goes to a Select Committee I may make a submission to restrict any smacks to the lower body. A flick on the ear will do no harm – a hard clip on the ear could.
If I though you were serious about combating very serious and sometimes fatal child abuse I would not be so concerned with childish name calling, You appear to pushing an agenda that says the State does not only knows more than the parent regarding discipline but sex education, contraception and abortion relating to their children.
I noticed that you were very quiet about a mother whose silence and even assistance led to the horrific death of her son. Maybe I missed your comment? I heard plenty of feminists callers to talkback saying the poor woman should have counseling not be sent to jail – yeah right – just like Tania Witika was a victim. I heard the former Commissioner of Children, Roger McClay say everyone deserves a second chance regarding her having contact with her latest child. Hopefully Roger has reconsidered his position. I heard he took a more sensible stance with the latest mother who contributed to her child’s death.
Roger is a decent man who I believe genuinely cares about children. We just have a different view on the smacking issue. I wish more of the anti-smacking lobby had the welfare of children as their top priority rather than a flawed ideology.
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Russell, Family First et al. are not "enabling abuse" as you put it. Instead, they are echoing the sentiments of a consistent 83% of the population who believe that a smack for the purpose of correction is not child abuse.
I would like you to please give a reference to where I have professed to be a "Christian soldier". Thank you.
Also, just on a technical note, the correct link for my blog post is, http://section59.blogspot.com/2008/01/anti-parental-authority-law.html
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OMG! Chuck's now getting his mates to start posting.
You would think someone who's been made to look a fool would keep his head down for a while. Instead he posts a link to remind us of the foolish things he said about the Mason case.
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they are echoing the sentiments of a consistent 83% of the population
So you got 3.4 million signatures? Didn't ask me.
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Off-topic: This is making me a bit queasy - as on another forum my user name is "chuck" - and I can't read this one here on PA without feeling not just a little dirty, but also guilty for holding the purported views.
ahh.. the moral and meta-physical dilemmas of online living.
:-)
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Just watched Sunday. Pretty one sided going for the sympathy vote for Mason. To me he came across as the sort of parent we have to deal with at school who sees nothing wrong with their children behaving in the same manner in the playground-swearing and hitting when things don't quite go your way. Cameron Bennett also calling section 59 the "anti smacking bill" pissed me off. Can't these media types get it right?
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Tony, I am not impressed with the swearing and abusive language by Mason or encouraged by Russell on this blog to discourage dissent. Did you by any chance hear the judge's instruction to the jury in regards the allegation of a punch? It actually proves that Bob and I were right. A guilty verdict does not prove he punched his boy.
All as we have to do is put the perfect parent Russell in charge of the world and we will have utopia. Like Mason I do not claim to be a perfect parent. I wonder if Russell has adult children if they will look up to him as Mason's did.
The majority of parent's do not claim to be perfect. However, most try to be good parents and they do not need like likes of Russell Brown, Helen Clark, John Key or the shocking example of poor parenthood Sue Bradford to tell them how to do their job.
Getting back the judge’s comments on Sunday he made it clear that it was not necessary for jury to accept that Mason punched his child to find him guilty of assaulting a child.
I know it would be expecting too much to expect Russell Brown to apologise for being wrong. Russell knows all the answers from AGW the world financial problems – just read his blog.
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