Hard News by Russell Brown

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Hard News: The GCSB Bill: eleventh-hour arguments

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  • Katita,

    No need to monitor my house or my life or my rodent derrière.
    I read these two articles today and wonder when our governemnt spy agencies will be seeking similar powers http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/aug/19/david-miranda-detention-outcry-terrorism-laws
    While this is just bizarre http://www.stuff.co.nz/technology/digital-living/9064410/UK-destroys-Guardian-drives-over-Snowden

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 67 posts Report Reply

  • Dave Patrick, in reply to Ian Dalziel,

    ...and is it too late to save 'decimated' as well !?

    Way too late for that now - The Oxford Dictionary has this to say:

    "decimate: verb [with object]
    1 kill, destroy, or remove a large proportion of:
    drastically reduce the strength or effectiveness of (something):
    2 (historical) kill one in every ten of (a group of people, originally a mutinous Roman legion) as a punishment for the whole group

    Origin:
    late Middle English: from Latin decimat- 'taken as a tenth', from the verb decimare, from decimus 'tenth'. In Middle English the term decimation denoted the levying of a tithe, and later the tax imposed by Cromwell on the Royalists (1655)

    Historically, the meaning of the word decimate is ‘kill one in every ten of (a group of people)’. This sense has been more or less totally superseded by the later, more general sense ‘kill, destroy, or remove a large proportion of’, as in the virus has decimated the population. Some traditionalists argue that this is incorrect, but it is clear that it is now part of standard English."

    Rangiora, Te Wai Pounamu • Since Nov 2006 • 261 posts Report Reply

  • Ian Dalziel, in reply to Katita,

    I read these two articles today

    fixed the links for ya...
    1: Miranda detention outcry

    2: UK destroys Guardian Hard drives!

    Christchurch • Since Dec 2006 • 7953 posts Report Reply

  • Ian Dalziel, in reply to Dave Patrick,

    Way too late for that now

    yeah...
    I knew...
    sigh...

    Christchurch • Since Dec 2006 • 7953 posts Report Reply

  • David Hood,

    Though it got not much coverage, I see that National support was down to 44% (from 51% in the poll before) in the latest Roy Morgan. The polling period (until August 11th) missed New Zealand's big interest in the GCSB (where google searches peaked the following week).

    Dunedin • Since May 2007 • 1445 posts Report Reply

  • Hilary Cameron,

    And a last ditch campaign has really got some traction, trending on twitter!

    Cross the Floor

    Unlikely to work, but I guess it is better than nothing.

    Christchurch • Since May 2013 • 15 posts Report Reply

  • Amanda Wreckonwith,

    Why all the concentration on Dunne?
    Let Aucklanders remember two words - Nikki Kaye

    Since Sep 2012 • 171 posts Report Reply

  • Ian Dalziel, in reply to Amanda Wreckonwith,

    Why all the concentration on Dunne?*

    ...and those newbie ACT MPs might be worth a crack,
    Prosser looked like he might have a mutable social compass,
    and they're all about the principles aren't they?

    *Still, I see Dunne has his cosy little 'Party status' sinecure restored.
    Now if he can just realise it comes from 'we the people' and
    not through the largesse of Mr Key and his circle of friends...

    Christchurch • Since Dec 2006 • 7953 posts Report Reply

  • Matthew Poole, in reply to Ian Dalziel,

    newbie ACT MPs

    uh, what? Act's only MP is Banks, who's about as likely to vote against these bills as he is to announce his impending nuptials to his secret gay lover. Prosser is NZ First, and NZ First are voting agin.

    Auckland • Since Mar 2007 • 4097 posts Report Reply

  • Matthew Poole, in reply to Amanda Wreckonwith,

    Why all the concentration on Dunne?

    Because he’s his own party whip. He’s answerable only to himself, what with being leader of a party of one, and having been stripped of his ministerial warrants there’s nothing Key can do as punishment other than withholding return of any ministerial warrants for the remainder of the term.
    The odds of a National MP crossing the floor are vanishingly tiny. This lot lack the moral integrity to consider standing up for civil liberties rather than following the party line.

    ETA: And Banks is just a National MP wearing a different shade of blue. He's an affront to pretty much everything Act supposedly stands for.

    Auckland • Since Mar 2007 • 4097 posts Report Reply

  • Ian Dalziel, in reply to Matthew Poole,

    Prosser is NZ First

    Brain fade....
    quake brain?
    senior moment...
    ...must take more magnesium!

    as you were!
    8- /

    Christchurch • Since Dec 2006 • 7953 posts Report Reply

  • Ross Mason,

    http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2013/aug/20/innocent-fear-david-miranda

    "I hesitate to draw parallels with history, but I wonder how those now running the surveillance state – and their appeasers – would have behaved under the totalitarian regimes of the 20th century. We hear today so many phrases we have heard before. The innocent have nothing to fear. Our critics merely comfort the enemy. You cannot be too safe. Loyalty is all. As one official said in wielding his legal stick over the Guardian: "You have had your debate. There's no need to write any more."

    Yes, there bloody well is."

    Upper Hutt • Since Jun 2007 • 1590 posts Report Reply

  • Paul Campbell, in reply to Ross Mason,

    "I hesitate to draw parallels with history, but I wonder how those now running the surveillance state – and their appeasers – would have behaved under the totalitarian regimes of the 20th century.

    They'd be doing the exact same thing but with more personal power ... it's these same sort of people who ran the Stasi and the McCarthy witch hunts and (avoids godwin-trap) - they would have been the totalitarian regimes - I'm sure they think that we have too much freedom as it is and that we all need to be kept an eye on for our own good

    Dunedin • Since Nov 2006 • 2623 posts Report Reply

  • Bart Janssen, in reply to Ian Dalziel,

    Way too late for that now

    yeah…
    I knew…
    sigh…

    I'm devastated

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 4461 posts Report Reply

  • Ian Dalziel,

    I’m sure they think that we have too much freedom as it is and that we all need to be kept an eye on for our own good

    and as our MPs debate The Inquiries Bill,
    Greens Fear Consequences Of Inquiries Bill
    fair enough too, when our 'good buddies' over in 'the land of the free'© are heading down the path of forcing journalists to reveal sources...

    Christchurch • Since Dec 2006 • 7953 posts Report Reply

  • Amanda Wreckonwith, in reply to Matthew Poole,

    Secret?

    Since Sep 2012 • 171 posts Report Reply

  • Amanda Wreckonwith, in reply to Paul Campbell,

    When civil liberties are in jeopardy, Godwin's tends towards irrelevancy.
    Hitler,Hitler,Hitler.
    Next...

    Since Sep 2012 • 171 posts Report Reply

  • Gary Young, in reply to Amanda Wreckonwith,

    I worry that when civil liberties are in this much jeopardy, Godwin's tends towards reality.

    Glenfield • Since Jun 2013 • 39 posts Report Reply

  • BenWilson, in reply to David Hood,

    Though it got not much coverage, I see that National support was down to 44% (from 51% in the poll before) in the latest Roy Morgan.

    Wow, that's a big move.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 10657 posts Report Reply

  • Paul Campbell, in reply to Amanda Wreckonwith,

    When civil liberties are in jeopardy, Godwin's tends towards irrelevancy.Hitler,Hitler,Hitler.Next...

    actually I was thinking more of Himmler ....

    Dunedin • Since Nov 2006 • 2623 posts Report Reply

  • ChrisW, in reply to nzlemming,

    You have engaged one of my pet peeves in that letter.
    ...
    fulsome

    I suggest this pet peeve is undeserving of your care and attention, that you should cut it loose from the pack and let it go feral, or preferably run it off a high cliff.
    ‘Fulsome’ has substantially returned from its aberrational meanings of recent centuries to its obvious Middle English basis in thoroughly full, commonly with connotations of being a little over-the-top (of full). I’ve scarcely ever seen or heard it as meaning otherwise in modern usage of the last few decades.

    But I’d agree that Alastair’s construction – “At the very least they were less than fulsome with the truth” – was non-ideal. Having already stated that the Speaker’s staff “lied”, he invites a reading of ‘fulsome’ with those over-the-top or ‘over-full’ connotations, so “less than fulsome with the truth” might still include ‘the full truth and nothing but the truth’.
    An insignificant detraction from a fine piece of advocacy journalism

    Gisborne • Since Apr 2009 • 851 posts Report Reply

  • Sacha, in reply to David Hood,

    Though it got not much coverage

    No reporters breathlessly pressing Collins and Joyce about their leadership aspirations..

    Ak • Since May 2008 • 19745 posts Report Reply

  • BenWilson,

    Passed. Plan B, vote out the government.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 10657 posts Report Reply

  • andin,

    Sez the Keyster

    "If I could disclose some of the risks and threats from which our security services protect us,"

    Mealy-mouthed BS if ever I heard it.
    "If I could"...What! You'd have to kill us? Your expecting an invasion any minute now.
    Arse...

    raglan • Since Mar 2007 • 1891 posts Report Reply

  • Kumara Republic,

    avoids godwin-trap

    Paul Buchanan draws parallels with Singapore, and certainly not for complimentary reasons. I personal draw parallels with Sir Joh's Queensland - right now you'd be forgiven for thinking that Mr Key is saying to the rest of us, "don't you worry about that!"

    The southernmost capital … • Since Nov 2006 • 5446 posts Report Reply

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