OnPoint by Keith Ng

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OnPoint: Dear Labour Caucus

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  • Russell Brown, in reply to rjal,

    Thanks. Glad you're sticking around as a commenter -- that's one good thing to come out of this trainwreck.

    Apologies to everyone, Gio included, for the way it has all played out.

    The thread seems to have regained a purpose, so I won't close it.

    And yeah, I really enjoyed last night. We recorded a fun Media7 show, and then seeing @peace play blew away any residual dumb resentment in me. It was just brilliant.

    I would, however, like to talk to someone about this here headache I've got.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 22850 posts Report Reply

  • Steve Barnes, in reply to Ian Dalziel,

    How do we disabuse John Key and co of the notion that Parliament is a forum for really bad stand up comedians –

    +1
    Personally I cringed. When all others had shown dignity and decorum johnkey came across like a 12 year old, making fun of others to improve his own standing. Couple that with a sneer that just makes you want to punch him and you have one big fail.

    Peria • Since Dec 2006 • 5521 posts Report Reply

  • Steve Barnes, in reply to ,

    “User pays” would be worth review,

    Indeed, in fact it is more like "user pays twice" we pay for the people that work out how much to charge for the service we pay taxes for.
    It has led to the ridiculous situation of the police having to account for the costs of everyday policing, the cost of rescues and crowd control, the cost of the jobs they get paid for. If that guy hadn't have gone missing in the bush would they really have laid off 100 police officers?. The cost remains the same, plus, of course, the cost of the accountants.
    Bah Humbug.

    Peria • Since Dec 2006 • 5521 posts Report Reply

  • Kumara Republic, in reply to Ian Dalziel,

    I caught a small portion of Key’s response to Shearer’s speech, it was a tirade about the Labour party’s internal workings, a very sad indication of his level of debate – he seems to think he has a mandate to blither on pointlessly rather than to prove why he should be our nation’s leader.

    "And I say to myself, it's not hard to see why they chose someone who's spent half his life in war-torn places like Somalia and Bosnia, because that's what the Labour Party's like now."

    Don't give up your day job, Johnny Boy. Don't you realise that there's no taxation or red tape in Somalia?

    The southernmost capital … • Since Nov 2006 • 5446 posts Report Reply

  • Heather Gaye, in reply to Steve Barnes,

    When all others had shown dignity and decorum johnkey came across like a 12 year old, making fun of others to improve his own standing.

    This is something that's rankled a *lot* recently - JK's habit of smarmy offhand rebuffs. I spat when I heard his comment about putting Shearer on the poverty committee provided Labour offer confidence and supply. I read that as nothing more than a hearty middle finger (and I'm really happy Shearer addressed the obvious partisanship in his speech).

    Given the comments here about it, I'm not going to bother reading Key's response, but given how tired he's been looking ever since the teapot tapes (granted I've no doubt that was partly to do with the media cherry-picking the photos), I wonder if his increasing churlishness is indication of rising stress levels?

    ...well, good. Probably it's just as churlish of me, but what I want for National and John Key with all the grand plans I despise - asset sales, beneficiary bashing, national standards, welfare privatisation, name it - is for their jobs this term to be an utter fucking nightmare.

    Morningside • Since Nov 2006 • 533 posts Report Reply

  • Rob Stowell,

    Norman did sound good. A very clear contrast to National.

    an urgent need to reduce poverty, retain assets and create meaningful work

    Maybe- but how? Shearer's answer isn't so impressive. Something borrowed: 'smart, green' and something blue: 'growing the pie' with innovative new businesses.
    I agree with a point Ben Wilson keeps making (and Russel Norman, in a different way)- we are foolish to base all our economic and social plans on the NZ economy 'growing' most years, and ever on, til the end of time.
    Globalisation will keep on tending to push NZ wages down- and hopefully, third-world wages up. NZ is plenty 'smart'- but it's nuts (and a little offensive) to assume there aren't also plenty of smart folks in India, China, Ghana and Bolivia.
    And just about our whole economy and way of life is based on cheap (dirty) energy and free (endless) water. Resources are finite.
    The world has the ability to sustain 7 billion people, and more. But not the way we're doing it now.

    Whakaraupo • Since Nov 2006 • 2120 posts Report Reply

  • Rob Stowell, in reply to Heather Gaye,

    is for their jobs this term to be an utter fucking nightmare.

    +1.
    But one we get to wake up from, please :)

    Whakaraupo • Since Nov 2006 • 2120 posts Report Reply

  • Raymond A Francis,

    Good on the Greens for their slightly more dignified approach to Parliment, although I do wonder if it will be maintained now they have extra numbers, hope so

    Regarding the Prime Minister, I think it depends on your shade of glasses on how his comments are regarded, I certainly do not remember an upset when Labours Cullen said
    "We won, they lost, let’s do lunch”.
    Which at the time was true but quite shocking

    45' South • Since Nov 2006 • 578 posts Report Reply

  • Raymond A Francis,

    Russell, a big thanks for this site and your pleasant moderation of it
    Like others here I have over-stepped good manners on occassion while in debate so I really appreciate what you do and some of the pressures on you while you do do it

    I hope you take time to rest or refuel this summer and of course if you travel South feel free to impose yourself on me

    45' South • Since Nov 2006 • 578 posts Report Reply

  • Sofie Bribiesca, in reply to Raymond A Francis,

    If you haven’t seen it, I urge you to try sit through it because I actually gave up 10 minutes in. It was embarrassing. There was nothing but spiteful behaviour worthy only of a school yard bully. And he got on a roll. Egged on by his idiot caucus, he proceeded to denigrate Labour by comparing them to starving war torn Bosnians and Somalians. How utterly repugnant.
    3 short sentences from Cullen was nothing compared to Key.The idiot is an embarrassment.

    here and there. • Since Nov 2007 • 6796 posts Report Reply

  • merc,

    "And I say to myself, it's not hard to see why they chose someone who's spent half his life in war-torn places like Somalia and Bosnia, because that's what the Labour Party's like now."
    Classy.

    Since Dec 2006 • 2471 posts Report Reply

  • Kumara Republic, in reply to merc,

    To me it comes across as moronic and try-hard rather than offensive, in a "there's a bomb in my luggage" kind of way.

    The southernmost capital … • Since Nov 2006 • 5446 posts Report Reply

  • Steve Parks, in reply to rjal,

    and I wanted to acknowledge that I found Steve's comment really helpful -- a point I'd neglected in my first comment.

    Thanks, and welcome to commentating on PAS.

    Wellington • Since May 2007 • 1165 posts Report Reply

  • Steve Parks, in reply to Raymond A Francis,

    I rarely agree with Raymond, so I’ll take the opportunity to say I agree with this:

    Russell, a big thanks for this site and your pleasant moderation of it
    Like others here I have over-stepped good manners on occassion while in debate so I really appreciate what you do and some of the pressures on you while you do do it

    Wellington • Since May 2007 • 1165 posts Report Reply

  • Kumara Republic,

    And surprise, surprise, Prostetnic Vogon Joyce pulled the middle finger at not 1, but three Govt agencies when they said Auckland should be allowed to set its own transport policy. Make it four if Treasury is included.

    The southernmost capital … • Since Nov 2006 • 5446 posts Report Reply

  • nzlemming, in reply to Kumara Republic,

    I hope this shows people it's not actually the public servants that make all the crappy decisions.

    Waikanae • Since Nov 2006 • 2937 posts Report Reply

  • Russell Brown, in reply to Kumara Republic,

    Auckland's transport policy will now be set by the New Zealand Herald's insane motoring columnist, Eric Thompson.

    His column yesterday is a towering work of intellectual achievement:

    It concludes thus:

    It has been reported that the Greens want a compact central city built on efficient transport, and cited Auckland Transport's estimate that the CBD capacity for employees and residents could triple if the rail link were built.

    Are they mad? By adding a couple of hundred thousand rugby supporters to the Auckland mix at the start of the World Cup, the place ground to a halt and fans couldn't use the rail system to even get to Eden Park.

    I read the Green Party Transport manifesto and it's entirely possible to see why only three people ticked the "like" box. If only three people like what the Greens are proposing it must be a load of tosh. Public transport is not efficient and never has been.

    Long live the car and build more roads.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 22850 posts Report Reply

  • Stewart,

    "motoring columnist" - partisan much?

    Te Ika A Maui - Whakatane… • Since Oct 2008 • 577 posts Report Reply

  • Lucy Stewart, in reply to Russell Brown,

    I read the Green Party Transport manifesto and it's entirely possible to see why only three people ticked the "like" box. If only three people like what the Greens are proposing it must be a load of tosh. Public transport is not efficient and never has been.

    It's like all the logical fallacies in the world have been lovingly piled atop one another for our bemusement.

    Wellington • Since Nov 2006 • 2105 posts Report Reply

  • Martin Lindberg, in reply to Russell Brown,

    the New Zealand Herald's insane motoring columnist, Eric Thompson.

    I am convinced that he's some kind of agent provocateur, placed there as a mole on behalf of the god-less green movement.

    ETA: I thought I had read all that a while ago. Indeed, the column was published 22 November.

    Stockholm • Since Jul 2009 • 802 posts Report Reply

  • Russell Brown, in reply to Martin Lindberg,

    ETA: I thought I had read all that a while ago. Indeed, the column was published 22 November.

    Whoops!

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 22850 posts Report Reply

  • Sacha, in reply to Russell Brown,

    stupidity like his all sounds the same after a while

    Ak • Since May 2008 • 19745 posts Report Reply

  • Joe Wylie, in reply to Sacha,

    stupidity like his all sounds the same after a while

    Having made it about 25% of the way through a book of Jeremy Clarkson's newspaper columns I have to agree. If that prick (for such he indisputably is) communicated something of the fun he supposedly experiences from playing with the wealth of toys at his disposal he'd be tolerable. Instead it's an endless exercise in petulant griping, leavened with schoolboy swagger.

    I'm told that there's a motoring correspondent in these parts who's a thoroughly decent human being, but the stereotype is pretty much masculine inadequacy on wheels.

    flat earth • Since Jan 2007 • 4593 posts Report Reply

  • Paul Williams, in reply to Rob Stowell,

    Rob, Labour's not got a fully developed alternative to National, yet. I understand that Shearer and co. see the holiday as a time to seriously sound out public priorities. I don't think that'll mean a complete reorientation from their pre-election approach though.

    My personal view is that redistribution must be combined with strategies to increase meaningful and sustainable employment. I'm not a growth fetishist though, but my understanding of the demographics is that we forecast a declining tax base relative to government costs so unless we're going to provide fewer services to our ageing population, we have to earn more offshore. That being the case, I agree with Shearer that we have to consider more than increasing tourism and dairying.

    Sydney • Since Nov 2006 • 2273 posts Report Reply

  • 3410,

    Must say, I've been - at every opportunity - vastly underwhelmed by Shearer's communication ability so far.

    Check out Key's RNZ Christmas message:

    podcast.radionz.co.nz/mnr/mnr-20111223-0729-christmas_message_from_john_key-048.mp3|

    Now compare Shearer's RNZ Christmas message:

    podcast.radionz.co.nz/mnr/mnr-20111223-0730-christmas_message_from_david_shearer-048.mp3

    WTF, man?

    (Note: links didn't work as links).

    Auckland • Since Jan 2007 • 2618 posts Report Reply

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