Speaker: To Smock is to Love
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Who elected Simon Barnett?
I'm getting fed up with self-appointed spokespeople being given unearned equal status by the media. I suppose they think they can by-pass the people because they're elected by God.
Brian Tamaki got zero-point-zilch per cent of the vote. Larry Baldock had one term thanks to Peter Dunne and the worm, and is now an ex-MP for a good reason.
Being media-smart is not a mandate. If Barnett wants to change laws he can go and scrap for votes like the rest of them. He might find it's much harder work than coming up with studio soundbites.
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Oh I am so glad I stumbled upon this article of yours today Anke! I blogged about this last week and have been feeling in a bit of an emotional vacuum about it since.
I was subjected to the traditional old kiwi "wooden spoon school of discipline" as a child and it traumatised me then and it traumatises me all over again as an adult every time I hear apparently ordinary-every-day New Zealanders speak proudly about how they smack(ed) their kids.
I had such an experience today - at the vet's of all places - as I dropped in to pick up my cat food and there was a group of 70-something blue-rinse ladies there discussing how horrid they think Sue Bradford is for trying to take away the right of younger generations to wield the wooden spoon as they did. I felt like some kind of alien being in the same room as that conversation.
So thank you again Anke, and thanks also to other commenter's such as Kirsten, Rebecca, Deborah, who validated my reality today. I look forward to a time in this country when the majority of us will look at smacking parents with the same horror and amazement that you and I do today - as if it is they who are the aliens.
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a more persuasive case for not dying your own hair?
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oops - I was about to a add .. he was auditioning for next years dancing with the stars
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Two differently worded questions, leading to very large majorities, respectively, for and against the amendment.
I'm against the controversial anti-smacking bill, but I support the anti-kid-hitting bill.
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Simon G - Destiny NZ got enough votes for a seat at the last election (they didn't get it of course, because we have a rule in New Zealand that if you don't get an electorate seat you have to earn enough votes for six list seats before you get one).
And I'm with Weston too - Simon Barnett did an incredible job of making the "pro-smacking" case.
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And I'm with Weston too - Simon Barnett did an incredible job of making the "pro-smacking" case.
lets stop this right now. when it comes to kids there is NO "pro-smacking" case.
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Tony - there is a case to be made for just about everything. I've been avoiding making the pro-smacking case; I'm not a fan of smacking, I just don't think it should be illegal (much the same way I feel about smoking).
Whatever one think of the balance of the smacking/no smacking argument, and I'm not sure I agree with him, Simon Barnett did a hell of job articulating his view!
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Delighted the s.59 section will be altered/obliviated. and huge kudos to Sue Bradford (for bringing up the bill); Katherine Rich (for staying staunch -geez, as Labour/Maori parties supporters, she's the only one we'd be wary of), and to some sensible politco negotiations going on-
Anke, that was an excellent post BUT-
*advertised* ANZ is not the reality.
You surely cannot say that we (ANZ in general) have *a mask* if you /you've read our literature (say, over the past 60 years?)
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I'm not a fan of smacking, I just don't think it should be illegal
yeah right graeme. you don't have to keep pretending it was ever legal anymore.
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Riddley - section 59 begins "every parent ... is justified"
The Crimes Act has this to say:
**Justified**, in relation to any person, means not guilty of an offence and not liable to any civil proceeding:
Earlier in this thread, David Haywood quoted Associate Professor Dawkins of the Otago University Law School as saying that under the present law:
provided the force is reasonable, the parent is not criminally liable. So much, then, for the claim that smacking is already unlawful.
He's right. The claim has no merit.
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Simon Barnett seems to be part of the Christian opposition coalition, based on a casual media survey. He votes United Future, quotes bible passages in interviews etc. However he claims his role as a spokesman is sort of random.
I do agree though, he did come across as the most articulate of the anti amendment crowd on Close Up the other night. If he had a regular haircut and wore more formal clothes he would have done even better I suspect.
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I just want to thank Anke as well - these last few weeks have also been a bit of a shock to my rose-tinted view of EnZed. And yes, I blogged about it also. I really must approve that pro-smacking comment I got on it the other week - but not until I've carefully composed my reply...
I was completely shocked by the absolute fervour with which some people appeared to be fighting tooth and nail to retain the right to hit their kids. It really horrified me. I felt quite ashamed of my adopted country - and still do. Not a nice feeling at all.
In the end, I want to live in a country where we believe - as a nation - that it's wrong to use physical force on anyone - especially those smaller and weaker than ourselves. I want to live in a country where we all understand that physical violence is not an appropriate way of dealing with - well, anything, really.
Is that too much to ask?
Hooray for the art of compromise on the Bill! Thank goodness for that...
And thanks to all those of you here who have been saying the things I've been thinking over the past month or so.
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nice blog webweaver.
thanks for a good thread Anke - shame it was superceded by events so soon. i think the ethics of that smocking needs a lot more debate though. -
i think the ethics of that smocking needs a lot more debate though.
Aha! This is the debate I've been waiting to watch...
(waits for merc)
(gets popcorn)
(oo, I feel like I'm at the THEATRE) -
merc,
I love Riddley and all, but...his negative smocking thang, well I don't like it one bit, I'm with Morrissey, "Smock lifters of the world, unite and take over." Also I used to work in factories as child labour, and smocks hold special memories and meanings for me, especially white smocks, hate them gray ones.
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well there's obviously an awful lot of disinformation going on around this topic.
we're talking here about smocking, not the humble, loving smocks of our childhoods in the factories and coalmines (though I agree m the grey ones are oppressive).
it's the stitching over pleats that can really cause long term damage, and it achieves nothing in terms of achieving a well-balanced, respectable garment. -
Stop mocking smocking!
Police will come knocking,
Then at their discretion,
You'll be taught a lesson -
no need to get all darning crochety Eusa.
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Geneva Convention on punnes or plays upon words- Alert!!
Warning, warning do not read, for pities sake!Well, quit needling me! Sew and Sew.
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i knew i'd be in for a tanning with that, you are the Master Punner Eusa.
Anyway, but your namesake is not an upholdster of the Convention. -
merc,
He was smocking you R. And I stand corrected, though if I was totally thinking you mean't work smocks, then is it so? However I have no defence you did intitially link to the embroidery thing and I usually follow ALL links (I am part Cherman und I obey!).
We Bedou though, of a night might sometimes whip up a wee carpet for later sale, I tried it with paintings but they won't sell, maybe a smock, I love uniforms... -
I made a smock for my female dog and the people got all upset when I wrote a song about it.
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merc,
Fellow PAS'ers I have all the bases loaded, my OCD has finally kicked in...
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We bring you "The Merc Show"
Quite an effort there. As well as OCD you'd have to have several personalities working on different computers.
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