After an exhaustive websearch, well into the wee hours, I can find no mention of a link between the Zika virus and microcephaly prior to the recent reports.
What was extremely prominent was the ‘conspiracy theory’ that there is some link between the release of the Bill Gates GE super mosquito in that particular region of Brazil (the north east) and the current Zika outbreak and microcephaly.
There is a much simpler and more scientifically plausible explanation.
Zika has been widespread in Africa for 40+ years. Most Africans will have been exposed to it as a child and will have developed an immunity.
So when it come time to have children none of the mother will catch Zika, they are already immune.
Now Zika has spread to South America, which has no history of Zika. None of the women have any immunity, so as Zika spreads it infects pregnant women and appears to lead to microcephaly.
In a generation, once Zika is established in South America the rates will drop again. However nobody wants to wait because that would be inhumane.
No weird super mosquito conspiracy theory needed.
BTW that "super mosquito" was far from super. They were males modified to mate with females but fail to produce viable offspring, since mosquito females only mate once in their lives that means a generation of mosquitos fails. The results of the trials were better than anyone could have hoped.
talking about WHY we’re talking about that thing in this particular way – serves a number of purposes too.
I would normally totally agree with you. Except the tone of that part of the conversation has shifted from discussion and trading of ideas to accusation and recrimination and is toxic.
By conflating the two discussions nothing is being progressed in either discussion and folks (or at least I) are getting tired and grumpy in the process.
I am happy to have another thread about the way we talk.
And at no point do I think you are being an arsehole about this.
The only value in this thread is if there are solutions.
There have been some suggested.
Arguing about who is listening is not helping because it is driving people away - people who might be able to help with solutions.
I feel like I've been accused of something (the actual thing varies) and I've tried to apologise but frankly I'm at the point of walking away.
You raised them.
glib and wrong, for multiple reasons.
What strikes mne is that in so many ways the next generation is freaking awesome.
Their attitude to gender diversity is amazing.
Their care for the environment makes most of us old folks feel inadequate
But on this? What about this makes it so different that they behave this way?
And yes I know many of that generation are as fucked off as I am about this.
Accepting everything the women are saying here, then this is a question
Why isn't the next generation better then us misogynist old white men?
What the hell did we do wrong that the next generation isn't better than us???
Real, but, and I mean this lovingly, much less relevant than any woman’s who feels like sharing theirs.
My experience and my only reason for bringing it up is to try and figure out what the hell is happening and how it can be stopped. I, by natural bent, look for points of change because they give clues to cause and hence possible solutions.
The fact is, it is a male problem, it's something about us men, particularly in groups. Women should not be forced to change their behaviour.
The solutions at the bottom of the cliff are all good, but it causes me deep frustration and anger to see groups of men (boys, from this aged perspective) display such hatred of women and no amount of bottom of the cliff stuff gets to the root of the hatred and contempt.
Try as I might I can't figure out the mental state that allows such horrible behaviour.
And, most scarily, if I can't understand the cause, then what stops it being me?
I am absolutely gobsmacked by the number of older men on here crying “not in my day”.
This is what I wrote
I honestly don’t remember my mates as a teenager being so utterly horrible to women. As I write that i feel like I’m shouting “In my day…”
I don't remember it being that way. I didn't experience it. I didn't see my teen cohort do it.
That was my experience.
Your experience was different.
Please can you accept that both things can be true. I don't have to be wrong for you to be right or vice versa.
If my experience was real then somehow my cohort was different and there might be something to learn from that. Or I could simply have been blind and you can ignore my experience.
Not @bart…that’s accidental.
I am just tired of seeing folks who would themselves strongly object to having their experiences invalidated quite happy to turn around and invalidate other people's experiences.
It's pretty clear there is a difference of experience being talked about here. As you say part of it is because victims (women) know they are being abused and bystanders (men) don't necessarily know.
But part of it could actually be that some people lived in an environment that really was different to what is going on now and ignoring that possibility is ignoring the opportunity to identify causes.
Either way this place has never been one where it was Ok to invalidate someones experience, I much prefer accepting that each person comes here with their experience and we have an opportunity to learn from it rather than trying to shut it down. By it isn't my house either.
Someone made a comment at tea time that is interesting.
They pointed out that when we search the internet or use twitter or facebook or any of the social media tools, the algorithms in the background promote items that are similar to what you’ve recently looked at.
It’s a feedback system. You can see its effect by just liking a couple of things on facebook and seeing what gets fed back to you. But it exists in every social media and search engine.
Essentially it’s like being in a room full of folks saying “yeah, you’re so right” even if what you are saying is stupid.
I wonder if part of what is driving these groups of boys to behave so openly abusive is that online that see that behaviour as universal, not because it is universal but because that’s what their information feed shows them.
And please don’t assume I’m so stupid as to be saying “it’s all the fault of the internet”.
it conveniently passes on the responsibility
That isn't what I think. It's exactly the reverse. It must be something we've done and it has to be something we change in order to fix it (I can see Emma nagging at me to stop trying to fix things).