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Posted at 2:27PM on 1 Sep 08. Permalink.

Brian Lochore must be spinning in his grave.

Did I miss something? Last week he wasn't in it!

Posted at 2:45PM on 1 Sep 08. Permalink.

Sorry, just an attempt at humour. Sir Brian is still alive and hitting

Posted at 3:49PM on 1 Sep 08. Permalink.

or maybe alive and spinning .....

I've been thinking about afternoon vs. night games - their demise seems to be the main reason that's given for the poor turnout at Carisbrook and its rather controversial and overblown replacement (not to be called 'Carisbrook') - coming soon to a court near you, it's going to be a knock down drag out fight.

Anyway they real fly-in-the-ointment is Sky - the rugby muckity-mucks have done a deal with Sky that requires night time games (for the Oz market) and no one wants to go to them when they can be warm at home. It's time they put their foot down and demanded a large percentage of day time games AND, more importantly 'blackouts'.

For a living I design settop boxes for the US cable market - we're required to include software that will black out games within a certain distance of a particular event - typically a home game will be blacked out unless ticket sales are greater than say 75% or more

How it's done depends on the TV provider (geographical coordinates, zip code, physical cables etc etc) any competent settop designer could nut out a design for Sky to use in about 10 minutes and implement it in a couple of weeks (after all they have a billing database telling them which settops are in which cities)

All it needs is the various rugby unions to grow some balls

Posted at 3:52PM on 1 Sep 08. Permalink.

Sorry, just an attempt at humour

I got it. Then I laughed.

Then I beat my kids about it.

Posted at 3:55PM on 1 Sep 08. Permalink.

I design settop boxes for the US cable market - we're required to include software that will black out games within a certain distance of a particular event - typically a home game will be blacked out unless ticket sales are greater than say 75% or more

Oh I always wondered how the NFL blackouts worked. I remember Jacksonville were the first team in ages to "suffer" a blackout in recent times.

Posted at 4:02PM on 1 Sep 08. Permalink.

I forgot to mention it in the post, but we were talking to the other folk in the line. After grumbling about having to wait outside for ages the conversation turned to how good it was to have an afternoon game again.

People like taking their kids to the game (shock!) and when they do it's easier if it's during the day (shock!) and in an atmosphere less likely to contain drunk retards (shock!)

All it needs is the various rugby unions to grow some balls

Despite all their manly posing and utterances of "mate", rugby unions tend to be quite devoid of balls.

Posted at 4:04PM on 1 Sep 08. Permalink.

It's a jersey I bought in Rotorua the night the Bay took on the British and Irish Lions

...

For those keeping score (and clearly someone was) it was 48-12 to the Lions.

Which is just one reason I haven't gone to a game. What on Earth was wrong with the name Wellington?

Posted at 4:08PM on 1 Sep 08. Permalink.

What on Earth was wrong with the name Wellington?

Heh, I hadn't even noticed.

Posted at 4:25PM on 1 Sep 08. Permalink.

As we exited some Wellington supporters told us "It gonna be a long trip home guys", to which I replied: "To Newtown?"

So, how long is it since you lived in The Bay, Hadyn? If Newtown is "home", why weren't you cheering for Newtown?

Posted at 5:11PM on 1 Sep 08. Permalink.

My girl and I got there an hour before kick-off. I knew the queue problems must have kicked in when the crowd went from about 5,000 at 2:35 (kick off) to a respectable 15,000 by half time.

The downside was that we had well and truly scoffed our bag of 16 donuts by the start.

NZRU take note: afternoon games grow the sport.

Even a 6pm start would be more family friendly. Especially for the Friday games.

Don't know how Wellington won game that so handsomely, they hardly saw the ball and were monstered in the scrums. I was confidently predicting a close 2nd half...

Posted at 5:45PM on 1 Sep 08. Permalink.

Graeme asked

What on Earth was wrong with the name Wellington?

I must resist the temptation ... no it's so easy though ... no I can be strong.

Anyway the serious answer to the question is, if they named the franchise "Wellington" then when they sold that franchise to, for example, Sydney, then it would look really really stupid to have a team in Sydney called "Wellington". Whereas "The Sydney Lions" just sounds like it was always meant that way.

Of course the above reasoning suggests that there is anyone in their right minds who would want to buy and NZ Rugby franchise in the NPC. See I resisted the temptation to be specific :).

The use of names that have no connection with a place derives of course from that cultural mecca we all want to emulate, the US of A, where buying and selling of sporting franchises is common as is moving the franchise when the local city doesn't front up with the appropriate bribes.

cheers
Bart

Posted at 6:41PM on 1 Sep 08. Permalink.

So, how long is it since you lived in The Bay, Hadyn? If Newtown is "home", why weren't you cheering for Newtown?

Cheer for the team from the city where I live? How gauche.

But really the answer is:
1. I lived in Tauranga and the Mount for 18 years. I've lived in Wellington for seven.
2. I love cheering for the underdog
3. Wellington vs Canterbury or Auckland and I'll cheer for Wellington.
and
4. While I am happy and proud to say I love and live in Wellington I also like to show off where I grew up

Posted at 10:40PM on 1 Sep 08. Permalink.

At the last Edinburgh sevens on the first day we were sat in front of a party of French teenagers who were in very fine voice and got into a very good natured chanting match with a group of Spanish kids. However they were polite and quite during the matches, unless France were on of course. An international sevens event is just the best advertisement for the joy that is rugby. Segregate the fans a la soccer? The very thought of it should send a shiver down the spine.

Besides who would you argue with in the pub afterwards over the beers if not the opposition supporters? Be boring and one sided with just your fellow bigots.

As for cheering where you happen to live at the moment, well pooh to that. Here I sit in Sunny Dundee (whoops it's just clouded over) in my 3 years old Otago NPC shirt. Just because I spent my teenage years in Auckland didn't remove the South from my blood. I remember going after work to Eden park 2 to watch Auckland play Wellington at cricket. I was the only one there cheering for Wellington, who were battting. Why? because it was good for Otago on the table if Wellington beat Auckland.

Posted at 11:34PM on 1 Sep 08. Permalink.

The use of names that have no connection with a place derives of course from that cultural mecca we all want to emulate, the US of A, where buying and selling of sporting franchises is common as is moving the franchise when the local city doesn't front up with the appropriate bribes.

Doesn't always work too well however. Take for example the Minnesota Northstars, a fairly good ice hockey team, who were sold, and moved to Dallas. Which is somewhat in the south, and not so much in the north at all.

So they changed the name to the Stars, and kept the basic imagery.

Posted at 8:04AM on 2 Sep 08. Permalink.

Doesn't always work too well however. Take for example the Minnesota Northstars

Or the Utah Jazz

Posted at 10:14AM on 2 Sep 08. Permalink.

I always wondered what had come first, the Lions nickname, or the (back in the day & maybe not now) Lion Breweries sponsorship.

I recall there being some controversy when it wasn't Lion Brown on the strip anymore, so maybe its a different sponsor now and the Lion's thing had already come into play.

I know Hawke's Bay has been the Magpies since or before the Ranfurly Shield glory days; but its more explainable given the colour of their hoops.

Posted at 11:05AM on 2 Sep 08. Permalink.

Doesn't always work too well however.

heh I'm sure we could build a neat list of names that wouldn't work

The Denver Dolphins?
The Minnesota Heat?

more?

Posted at 11:12AM on 2 Sep 08. Permalink.

The Denver Dolphins?
The Minnesota Heat?

Originally American Football teams were named after baseball teams. Hence the first televised football match was between the Philadelphia Eagles and the Brooklyn Dodgers.

It also explains the Cardinals and the Bears. The Cardinals were originally a Chicago team that was moved to St Louis (like the baseball team) and then Arizona.

Posted at 11:47AM on 2 Sep 08. Permalink.

Back to the children. My daughter 2 1/2 years at the time and able to sing the national anthem word for word...(says a little less about her and more about my dogged determination for my child to have a party trick)... attended a game dressed in princess outfit and purple feather boa. She danced to the music and cheered for the cheer leaders, only to cower into my shoulder at the roar of the crowd during the game. She wants to return to the rugby, if only for everything that makes for a great day and isn't actually rugby.

We have to get the children to the game to create great supporters. This means daytime matches. There are too many other things they would rather watch on the telly.
As rugby becomes less a part of our cultural identity, (not a bad thing) I wonder how many fans there will be in ten years time.

Posted at 12:17PM on 2 Sep 08. Permalink.

Hear hear: Nothing wrong with going to the rugby as princesses.

But black is hard to work for a gown without looking like your a mistress at the wife's funeral...

Posted at 12:43PM on 2 Sep 08. Permalink.

Back to the children. My daughter 2 1/2 years at the time ... attended a game dressed in princess outfit and purple feather boa.

There are too many other things they would rather watch on the telly.

Absolutely. there is an irony that the unions seem to want to grow the game by enabling more of us to see it by sitting at home on the couch.

Posted at 2:04PM on 2 Sep 08. Permalink.

AND, more importantly 'blackouts'.

Penalize people who happen to be in a nearby postcode and can't make it to the game? They do that in Australia and it's a crap idea, you can't talk about the game with anybody in another part of the country and plenty of people have legitimate reasons for not going along on the day. It ends up punishing spectators instead of encouraging them.

Posted at 4:51PM on 2 Sep 08. Permalink.

I'm pretty sure Jimmy Southgate is on the right track about how the Wellington team became the Lions. In the early to mid 90s they were sponsored by Lion Brown and that was pretty much the basic beer around town. Consequently they had a Leo the Lion mascot patrolling the touchline at Athletic Park as much as beer advertising as doing mascot duties. At some point everyone just started calling them the Lions and then I think it actually got picked up by the WRU itself. So it was kinda organic - if you can call being prompted by beer advertising 'organic'.

I take my daughter to the Phoenix games. I'm somewhat heartened by the news that there was plenty of noise at the rugby, because my experience has usually been that rugby crowds mostly just sit in glum silence except when there's a big shove on or their team scores. Football crowds make their own entertainment, and I can tell you it really is entertaining watching a five-year-old chanting "same old aussies, always cheating" when the opposition infringes.

Just a shame the stadium is actually such a p***-poor venue for anything that is played on a rectangular field.

Posted at 5:02PM on 2 Sep 08. Permalink.

oh and as for night rugby, i just simply don't watch it, either live or on tv. it clashes with my wife's television interests and getting the young one to bed. sky tv would no doubt tell me to get a double connection installed, but i'm not going to do that. so until they play more in the afternoon, or else outsource all games to australia and play them at 10pm nz time, the game is basically not on the agenda for me. I wonder how many others who actually do have an interest in rugby have the same issue? i remember day time games as best of both worlds. i could watch the game in the afternoon, and spend time with people who didn't like rugby in the evening (or with people who did like rugby, but by then preferred to put the stereo on loud instead).

Posted at 5:09PM on 2 Sep 08. Permalink.

hear hear on the day/night games issue.

The other thing was if you are still too damn Scottish to fork out for Sky [guilty] the delayed telecast was on at a reasonable time.

But even if we had Sky, I'd probably be too damn stuffed by the time it came on.

Do they still do radio broadcasts of rugby games? Because I'm old enough to remember when they were neat.

I remember the Lions '77 Tour: I was 12, we'd put the radio on in the shed for the provincial games. Clear memories of drenching the bull calves while listening to the Counties/Thames Valley game.

Shit that dates me.

Posted at 10:46AM on 3 Sep 08. Permalink.

The South African Rugby Union seems to have balls enough to keep afternoon games even though a 7.30 game would be good for Tri Nations partners.

My kids have gone to one test only. 5.30pm Eden Park, Australia. They still say it was one of their most exciting nights and it played in Aussie at 2.30pm. Perfect.

And finally, the pub after tradition is dying with the night matches.

Posted at 12:13PM on 3 Sep 08. Permalink.

The reason that SA is allowed to get away with day games is the European TV market, which is bigger than Aus / NZ.

Wellington are called the Lions because of Leo their long-term mascot, who has been around since the 1950s, way before beer advertising was legal. Same reason that Waikato are called Mooloo, Taranaki is Ferdinand etc.. They’re the organic names.

If you want a naff non-organic nickname I’d have thought it’d be hard to go past BoP Steamers, and all associated connotations.

Posted at 1:16PM on 3 Sep 08. Permalink.

Just quietly BoP fans don't like "Steamers" either.

Posted at 1:30PM on 3 Sep 08. Permalink.

It’s even worse than the Turbos.

And I don’t say that lightly.

Posted at 4:59PM on 3 Sep 08. Permalink.

Counties-Manukau Steelers isn't too flash either.