Public Address | System (Home)

Posted at 3:45PM on 23 Feb 09. Permalink.

Meh... any reputation that can be materially damaged by a 'roid on the body politics like Michael Laws, probably isn't worth defending.

Agree, to a point. He clearly has an audience of devoted listeners. And we all know what the bite of a rabid dog can lead to.

Posted at 3:53PM on 23 Feb 09. Permalink.

I do understand that the copyright owners have felt under siege on this one.

I feel for them too - people want no-DRM, full-access, free-to-distribute, easily-copied examples of their work and seem to see no ground to be given.

As much as DRM is a shite response (and 92A a million times worst), I do sometimes think that maybe the legitimate consumer might have to give a bit of ground.
I'm not close enough to the workings to know what that might be though (registered devices that play copies? an acceptance of limited-numbers-of-copies per purchase etc etc?)

Posted at 4:18PM on 23 Feb 09. Permalink.

Result!

Government announces delay in 92A enactment until March 29. If no agreement by then, it will be suspended.

Hat-tip: MsBehaviour on Twitter.

My reading is that this puts pressure on the owners' lobby to deal.

Even if agreement reached, government to monitor first six months and review.

Posted at 4:20PM on 23 Feb 09. Permalink.

If no agreement by then, it will be suspended.

Who is the group that provides formal agreement?

Posted at 4:21PM on 23 Feb 09. Permalink.

Result!

Wow... Generally if I take part in a cause, it's only to see it fail. Weird.

Posted at 4:22PM on 23 Feb 09. Permalink.

I feel for them too - people want no-DRM, full-access, free-to-distribute, easily-copied examples of their work and seem to see no ground to be given.

I do wonder if the larger media companies had been willing to re-examine their business model earlier, and had not made legitimately purchased downloadable product so unattractive by tying it up with poorly implemented DRM, and restrictive conditions, then perhaps the current user might not have got into the convenience of pirated product, and wouldn't expect all that for free.

I'm thinking particularly of situations such as pc games that no-one can install because of the DRM, so purchasers have to use cracked copies just to get what they paid for, or Microsoft's "Plays for Sure" (think i've got that right?) DRM that they just stopped supporting from one day to another with no warning.

But then another bit of me (the cynic) says it's hard to be more attractive than free.

Posted at 4:24PM on 23 Feb 09. Permalink.

Who is the group that provides formal agreement?

The Telecommunications Carriers Forum has written the draft code for its members and is negotiating with RIANZ et al. But that doesn't cover the other parties likely to be regarded as ISPs under the law.

Posted at 4:29PM on 23 Feb 09. Permalink.

The Telecommunications Carriers Forum has written the draft code for its members and is negotiating with RIANZ et al. But that doesn't cover the other parties likely to be regarded as ISPs under the law.

Thanks - so I guess it's a more informal thing with Government deciding if most major parties seem to be happy enough.

Posted at 4:30PM on 23 Feb 09. Permalink.

Woo-hoo!

Posted at 4:32PM on 23 Feb 09. Permalink.

I second Idiot Savant's wohoo! (Or third, or fourth, or fifth, if I have hit post too late!)

Great work to all those who put pressure on over this. Now we just need to follow-it through and make sure it happens the way we need it to.

Posted at 4:35PM on 23 Feb 09. Permalink.

Thanks - so I guess it's a more informal thing with Government deciding if most major parties seem to be happy enough.

That's the weird thing. There's no formal right in the law for RIANZ et al to have a view on the TCF code -- it's more of a courtesy.

The TCF seems to be in quite a strong position. Hopefully they won't turn around and dump on their customers by shifting cost and other burdens that way.

Posted at 4:36PM on 23 Feb 09. Permalink.

Wow... Generally if I take part in a cause, it's only to see it fail. Weird.

Indeed, I have some serious cognitive problems with success.

Kudos to everyone who worked so hard, and stayed so reasonable, achieving this result.

Posted at 4:36PM on 23 Feb 09. Permalink.

Government announces delay in 92A enactment until March 29. If no agreement by then, it will be suspended.

Hopefully this means the copyfight bomb will be defused, rather than the fuse being made longer.

Posted at 4:38PM on 23 Feb 09. Permalink.

Kudos to everyone who worked so hard, and stayed so reasonable, achieving this result

Indeed. I do like to think I'm a reasonable sort of pig-fucker.

Posted at 4:50PM on 23 Feb 09. Permalink.

The underlying copyright issues won't go away. We should celebrate that a bad law is being delayed but much better to promote something more useful for next generation.

Is that creative commons or something else?

Posted at 4:51PM on 23 Feb 09. Permalink.

W00t.

Considering the Prime Minister said he'd 'seen a couple of articles' about the issue (or similar) this time last week that's quite an achievement.

Posted at 4:55PM on 23 Feb 09. Permalink.

Jason,

Creative Commons is definitely a part of the next generation of copyright, but I doubt the big labels and studios will buy into it. Then again, there's a good number of scifi authors now who simultaneously release copyright books on paper and CC-licensed ebooks. Not sure if that really maps for music, since there's still a significant difference between a paper book and an ebook. MP3 vs CD, not so much.

Posted at 4:57PM on 23 Feb 09. Permalink.

Apologies
Sent an email to apologise for not making it on Saturday night,having RSVP'd, but discovered later that the email had been returned. Hope no one missed out on my account.

Posted at 5:02PM on 23 Feb 09. Permalink.

Indeed. I do like to think I'm a reasonable sort of pig-fucker.

The man has a way with words.

Posted at 5:05PM on 23 Feb 09. Permalink.

I do wonder if the larger media companies had been willing to re-examine their business model earlier, and had not made legitimately purchased downloadable product so unattractive by tying it up with poorly implemented DRM, and restrictive conditions, then perhaps the current user might not have got into the convenience of pirated product, and wouldn't expect all that for free.

Too true. It's now been 10 years (to the month, I think), since I discovered the wonders of Napster and I'd argue that, fundamentally, none of what's happened since was unforseeable then.

Woo-hoo

Wow. Colour me surprised.

Posted at 5:12PM on 23 Feb 09. Permalink.

What I was trying to get to - we are now at the point where a fair number of people know that S92a etc. is a bad idea /

what I don't get ( and I've been looking for some time.) is some form of useful alternative to the wider issue.

Or is that still too hard for everyone.

Posted at 5:13PM on 23 Feb 09. Permalink.

the TCF are now arguing from a point of strength - time to pull back to the point where RIANZ baulks and wont sign - then the whole thing gets suspended

Maybe now's also the time for some more grass-roots rights holder's organisations to spring up and join the negotiations

Posted at 5:22PM on 23 Feb 09. Permalink.

Indeed. I do like to think I'm a reasonable sort of pig-fucker.

The man has a way with words.

And with pigs apparently.

Posted at 5:23PM on 23 Feb 09. Permalink.

Or is that still too hard for everyone.

It is hard. Witness the back and forth on the current copyright thread, which is up to 40 pages, some of which has even been amicable. There are some entrenched positions and some very different understandings and that's without any of the RIANZ or other acronym type groups involved.

Doesn't mean we shouldn't try, though. Come on over and join the fun ;-)

Posted at 6:44PM on 23 Feb 09. Permalink.

Let me add belated and surprised cheers. I think this is the first time I've *ever* seen public protest accomplish something, legislature wise. Long may it continue.

Posted at 7:05PM on 23 Feb 09. Permalink.

APRA don't have any corporate masters just to be clear. AMCOS on the other hand does.

Just so everyone's clear on AMCOS... From the APRA site:
"While APRA and AMCOS are independent companies, since 1 July 1997, APRA has managed the affairs of AMCOS and the organisations staff and offices have been amalgamated."

Posted at 7:25PM on 23 Feb 09. Permalink.

It's just a pity that at this late stage TV3 News' Hillary Barry still managed to refer to the section as "twenty-nine A".

Posted at 7:27PM on 23 Feb 09. Permalink.

* Gah... "Hilary" - I knew I'd screw up my first post :(

Posted at 8:00PM on 23 Feb 09. Permalink.

After going to the protest and seeing this whole thing unfold on twitter - it's good to have a win, or at least a stay of execution.

This stupid, stupid law would have meant the end of public internet, or at least prevented it from being free. I was concerned at the effects on internet cafe sites and coffee shop hotspots.

Posted at 8:04PM on 23 Feb 09. Permalink.

the technology doesn't replace the artists, it replaces the middle men

Mr C, nicely put. This is what my less than coherent rants are about... my metaphor is Old White Men. Over the years I've watched what are almost invariably wealthy, anonymous OWM hold back the progress of society, not in nice simple innocuous ways (which I'm afraid Copyright probably is in the grand scheme of things) but in some very serious areas that actually hurt people.

Tobacco, the motor car (my class designed a hybrid for a school project in 1983 - we 14 year olds could work out it is more efficient for town driving), the electricity generation / distribution industry, big pharma, food... in all these areas are versions of the classic conservative / liberal fight.

Personally the thing I find most offensive about the copyright / IP stuff is that it is a classic example of a big economy bullying a small one. Which is how it is, but I don't have to like it.

I think this is the first time I've *ever* seen public protest accomplish something

I was lucky enough (in a strange way) to experience this... disposed of a Prime Minister and got rid of a tax. Not bad eh?