Hard News by Russell Brown

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Hard News: "Evil called: Can you make a meeting at 11?"

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  • insider outsider,

    Well he was mentioned in one of Hager's books so may feel a personal connection.

    But it may also be because a story with so little substance was being given so much airtime. Just as at the last election Labour got a lot over the mythical american bagmen.

    As he said it was a huge irony that so much time was being spent on it and other issues ignored and not because of CT but because of Hager.

    nz • Since May 2007 • 142 posts Report Reply

  • Stanley Pointen,

    Craig, the difference is that the Hodgson revelations were made in the open, clearly sourced, and backed up, just as the attempts to label Mr Key as 'slippery', however hamfisted, were. The issue here is the claim by Hagar that there is a sophisticated underground campaign, executed by 'third parties' and fellow travellers, aimed at blowing the dog-whistle on Clark personally and on the government generally. Hooten's virulent attack on Hagar and Haare gives the game away. It would be easily cleared by the Leader of the Opposition simply denying the claim. Why won't he?

    Auckland • Since May 2008 • 25 posts Report Reply

  • dc_red,

    Err, who's this "Street" person? Not Maryan Street, Minister of Housing, surely? I'm lost.

    Oil Patch, Alberta • Since Nov 2006 • 706 posts Report Reply

  • Paul Campbell,

    At this point I get to reveal that I was the "Paul" who's email was read on air just before they went on (I was pleasantly surprised to find I wasn't the only one - did I/we catch Hooten a little off guard? I hope so)

    I've received 2 push polls thru the mail from my local National list MP - one just before the last election, and one after - both of them contained questions that were worded so that if you were on the right the answer was obvious and if your politics were more on the left neither option represented your opinion leaving you in a "have you stopped beating your wife yet?" sort of situation with the least odious alternative being the National party line.

    I lived in the US for years before moving back to NZ and had to put up with push-poll telemarketers so this seemed so transparent to me - when I showed it to local friends they seemed surprised when I showed them how they were being manipulated - I suspect that this current fuss will raise this issue so that more people will be able to be discriminating when this sort of thing happens

    I actually called our MP on this in a letter to the local paper - and got a response that she didn't know what a "push-poll" was (yeah right) - and then changed the subject to show all the things her bogus constituent poll had discovered

    Dunedin • Since Nov 2006 • 2072 posts Report Reply

  • simon g,

    Today's values test: which deserves more attention, from voters and media alike?

    - the decision by the party leader to employ Crosby and Textor

    - the decision by some party official to use a stock family photo in a pamphlet

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 707 posts Report Reply

  • Jackie Clark,

    People really do feel that Labour do not know what it is like to try and raise a family, drive a car and keep a their heads above water
    I think this perception is the real problem for Labour

    And a party of business people led by a self made millionaire would know what, exactly, about how "ordinary" people fare? I don't buy this "bloody academics" bullshit. I'd rather have that than accountant, business people, and god forbid, playcentre mummies running our country, as we have had in the past. And as for the world not ending if National get in, and people voting Green because they think Labour is stuffed anyway......

    Mt Eden, Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 3122 posts Report Reply

  • David Cormack,

    Craig as much as I enjoy your verbose replies, of late they do tend to consist of "your example of National being shits isn't correct because Labour are shits too".

    I get what you're saying but often it's just not relevant.

    Suburbia, Wellington • Since Nov 2006 • 216 posts Report Reply

  • insider outsider,

    Stanley

    Hager's claim was so waffley that it should be dismissed as the fantasies of a conspiracist. He refused to cite any actual rumours or evidence that there was any organisation to them, and when challenged quickly began to backpeddle. Just the dog whistling innuendo that he accuses C&T of.

    His opinion that "it's worse than ever" is more a sign of his closeted existence - indeed I'd say it was a lot worse last election because of Brash's stupid comments about Clark and her lack of family, and the vitriol in Parliament from Labour about affairs.

    I wonder if he has considered that rumours might be rising because HC is lower in the polls than ever and there is an election around the corner. Just a theory...

    nz • Since May 2007 • 142 posts Report Reply

  • Russell Brown,

    ADVISORY:

    This week's Media 7 should be a goodie. We're discussing drugs and the news media with a panel comprised of Ross Bell of the NZ Drug Foundation; Police Association spokesman Greg O'Connor; and Nandor Tanczos.

    If you'd like to join us tomorrow evening at The Classic in Queen St, hit "Reply" below the original blog post (or, if you're logged in, the little envelope under my name to the left of this message) and let me know asap.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 18666 posts Report Reply

  • Angus Robertson,

    Greg Wood

    Or even better, perhaps C/T see this as part of their own PR work...? Getting your firm's name on the front page on a rainy weekend -- nefarious skillz!

    A rexamination of the 2005 election campaign probably is not going to harm National. The opinions of Nicky Hager on some obscure Aussie consultancy versus $800,000 and the EFA is (intentionally raised or not) probably a winner for the Nats.

    Auckland • Since May 2007 • 984 posts Report Reply

  • insider outsider,

    Paul

    I don't think those fit the push poll mould. PP's tend to be anonymous and undermining not overt like a party brochure. If those are push polls then what are the ongoing referneces by Labour and allies to secret agendas, big money donors, welfare and health cuts etc with no supporting evidence? That;s really just politics, nothing else.

    nz • Since May 2007 • 142 posts Report Reply

  • Paul Williams,

    __The two parties have more in common that they have differences

    The sky will not fall__

    Indeed, it won't.

    Hmmm, although I suspect you're correct and I anticipate more and more announcements by National largely adopting existing Labour policies (which is what Rudd did here without Crosby/Textor's advice), Kiwisaver et al, we still have little insight into National's position on many issues.

    I'd not feel quite so relaxed until they announced their housing, health and welfare policies.

    I'm astounded that Hooten is on radio. I've been away too long it appears. He might be comparatively articulate but he's far from the sharpest analyst and I struggle to believe he's capable of bipartisan commentary.

    I make the following comment without a hint of attitude; is he the best the 'right' can come up with? I can think of many others who're better advocates for the 'other-side', more intelligent, experienced and frankly sensible... perhaps they're too smart to accept the offer (surely this explains why PAS's very own Craig Ranapaia is not doing this slot?)

    Sydney • Since Nov 2006 • 2193 posts Report Reply

  • Craig Ranapia,

    Craig, the difference is that the Hodgson revelations were made in the open, clearly sourced, and backed up

    One out of three is really bad, Stanley. I'd also question how 'in the open' any allegations made under parliamentary privilege really are. But using your logic every tawdry claim ever made by Ian Wishart is "in the open", so it's OK? At the time Hodgson was challenged to hand over any evidence he had that Key had made multiple false statutory declarations to the appropriate authorities. As far as I'm aware, they're still waiting. But I guess that wasn't the point, was it?

    Err, who's this "Street" person? Not Maryan Street, Minister of Housing, surely? I'm lost.

    Oh, crap. Kathryn Ryan -- who I keep confusing with Kathryn Street, who was Radio New Zealand's chief political reporter, before going over to "the dark side" where she is now the Prime Minister's chief spin-thing.

    I apologise for the confusion.

    North Shore, Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 11856 posts Report Reply

  • Paul Campbell,

    I/O - there's lots of different sorts of push polls - the party-branded ones like the ones I've been receiving tend to be milder and more subtle - but that's because they are trying to associate their message with that brand (and besides she could do it with her parliamentary stamp for free) - in my experience the anonymous phone ones tend to be more overt

    (Our home telephone system effectively screen telemarketers so I have no idea if any of them are calling)

    But since they're really election advertising I guess any push poll this time around will have to include a statement saying who's paying for them - presumeably at the beginning BEFORE you have a chance to hang up on them

    Dunedin • Since Nov 2006 • 2072 posts Report Reply

  • Russell Brown,

    Okay, I've listened to Hooten-Harre.

    Matthew Hooten is often off-message, to the chagrin of his party. It's what makes him interesting.

    But this morning's effort was so on message it hurt. Both the rhetoric and the shouting about the nasty Mr Hager were fairly scripted.

    It was funny that he said "it seems" C/T were working for Key. Either he was being disingenuous, or he was out of the loop to a humiliating degree. I'm sure Matthew would prefer us to think the former.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 18666 posts Report Reply

  • Craig Ranapia,

    Craig as much as I enjoy your verbose replies, of late they do tend to consist of "your example of National being shits isn't correct because Labour are shits too".

    I get what you're saying but often it's just not relevant.

    *sigh* Where the fuck did I say anything as stupid as ""your example of National being shits isn't correct because Labour are shits too"? I just think people who are trying to construct some vast right-wing conspiracy here, need to have pointed out their own... well, 'hypocrisy' or 'partisan special pleading' is probably unfair in most cases. But I find it interesting just how defensive some folks get when pointing out that there's a hell of a lot of stones being thrown around a neighbourhood full of glasshouses.

    Hope that clears up a few things, David, and wasn't too 'verbose'. Guess Darth Textor and Dalek Crosby haven't sent me my talking points yet.

    North Shore, Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 11856 posts Report Reply

  • Sarah Flynn,

    To my mind, John Key has been getting worse as he goes along. I remember listening to an interview he gave on Nat Radio right after ousting Don Brash, and I was (to my surprise) impressed. Key was brimming with confidence, articulate, energetic... and (at least as I recall) he answered questions directly, without fluffing around. Part of me (the pinko lefty labour-voting part) thought, uh-oh, here's some serious competition. However - maybe it's just because the contrast with Brash (cf clueless extremism, woeful political instinct etcetc) was so pronounced - but I also felt a great sense of relief that a decisive, sensible person would end up in charge if National actually won the next election.

    Suffice to say, I don't feel so confident any more! Key ducks, he flubs, and that AWFUL video ("I'm ambitious for NZ") just sank my boat (probably the PR company's idea, but if Key can't spot a stinker like that, I'm not brimful of optimism for his future as PM). A shame, as I think he WILL end up as PM at this rate, but I don't think he'll survive long and I can't see another leader of HC's competence anywhere on the political spectrum.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 16 posts Report Reply

  • slarty,

    We're discussing drugs and the news media with a panel comprised of Ross Bell of the NZ Drug Foundation; Police Association spokesman Greg O'Connor; and Nandor Tanczos.

    Oh how I wish I could... I shall look forward to Greg's points with eager anticipation. I'd hate to be in his position: reminds me of Mohammad Saeed al-Sahhaf.

    Since Nov 2006 • 290 posts Report Reply

  • Craig Ranapia,

    But this morning's effort was so on message it hurt. Both the rhetoric and the shouting about the nasty Mr Hager were fairly scripted.

    Or he really, really loathes Hager and (I suspect) the feeling is entirely mutual. I chose the example of Lila Haare losing her mind quite deliberately. In the end, I think she sincerely believes that the Auditor-General "colluded" with National over that report. I sincerely believes she's a couple of kumara short of a hangi on that subject, and both her and Hooten really went OTT far too often on that subject and Ryan should have slapped them both down more often -- and energetically -- than she did. But I also think it would be unfair to accuse them of being "on message" or "scripted" -- which the connotations that they were being bad faith finger puppets.

    It was funny that he said "it seems" C/T were working for Key. Either he was being disingenuous, or he was out of the loop to a humiliating degree. I'm sure Matthew would prefer us to think the former.

    And if it's the latter, would the appropriate conclusion be that he's guessing just like everyone else. The difference being that he doesn't lunge for the garlic and pointy sticks at the mention of evil foreigners?

    North Shore, Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 11856 posts Report Reply

  • insider outsider,

    Sarah

    One of the things PR does is manage risk. It often does this by formalising the engagement with the media through key messages and photo ops etc. That can remove sponteneity which can often be an individual's strength. Problem with sponteneity is it can be risky, which means it has to be managed...

    Clark by all accounts is very good in small groups and comes across as very warm. I find she is the opposited in staged events like Question Time where she often appears stilted

    nz • Since May 2007 • 142 posts Report Reply

  • Paul Campbell,

    But he's the leader - he shouldn't need "to be managed" because that just gives everyone that there's a bunch of backroom (dare I saw "hollow") men pulling the strungs

    Dunedin • Since Nov 2006 • 2072 posts Report Reply

  • Ian MacKay,

    Russell: Perhaps a topic for Media 7 could be "Polling and the questions they ask" and "The role the Media has in reporting polls" and the "ethics of polling" and "The place of Push Polls in NZ Democracy".

    Bleheim • Since Nov 2006 • 498 posts Report Reply

  • insider outsider,

    PAul

    Key may be the leader but is still part of a machine that aims to go on with or without him. His strings are pulled just like HC, who has large numbers of PR people and political advisers, gets media training, and has her picture enhanced.

    nz • Since May 2007 • 142 posts Report Reply

  • Kyle Matthews,

    Where the fuck did I say anything as stupid as ""your example of National being shits isn't correct because Labour are shits too"?

    Hmm. Craig, you responded to Russell talking about Key by saying:

    OTOH, Russell, it's not hard to feel that folks are getting pretty damn sick of the slick, punchy and totally content free soundbite that Clark is very, very good at as well.

    Which feels to me to be close enough to what David said.

    Can I ask you a serious question, and if you don't feel comfortable answering it publicly, fair enough.

    How do you, as a member of the National Party, feel about Key using Crosby Textor? Not just in relation to today, but the past couple of years, and the coming four months?

    Since Nov 2006 • 6157 posts Report Reply

  • Simon Armitage,

    Sarah,

    I agree with your views on Key - certainly a political and intellectual lightweight.

    However, I disagree with you about no leadership on the horizon.
    Re-Introducing - Mr Bill English... The Nats were perhaps a bit too quick to replace a seasoned politician like English with a superficial and politically naive Brash, who was subsequently replaced by the superficial and politically naive Key. English has kept his head down and performed well running attacks on the EFA, landing significant blows by simply sticking to the facts rather than relying on 'spin'.

    Although Key might get them over the line, I won't be at all surprised if English ends up taking the reigns soon after.

    Auckland • Since May 2008 • 7 posts Report Reply

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