Patroclus can stand to watch no longer, and begs Achilles to be allowed to defend the ships. Achilles relents, and lends Patroclus his armor, but sends him off with a stern admonition to not pursue the Trojans, lest he?

A win for the All Whites against Italy tonight in the second round of World Cup group play would be like the Netherlands beating the All Blacks in pool play at the Rugby World Cup — it isn't going to happen.?

Oh, no, there is a far greater likelihood of?

But don't write the All Whites off – the Italian press isn't for sure

If you can translate some of the before-and-after coverage for us, I'll fix it so you win some o' that Toi Toi wine ;-)

the king of the fake tanned fucktards

now *that's* poetry

If you can translate some of the before-and-after coverage for us, I'll fix it so you win some o' that Toi Toi wine ;-)

I can try a little summary. The report by Gazzetta dello Sport on the game against Slovakia was very positive on the All Whites', much lauded?

That's quite a high proportion really.

Another factor to remember tonight. By my count at least 4 matches so far have been on the issuing of a red card.

the problem is, it is likely to be a kiwi on the receiving end...or not. Come to think of it, those excitable latins are capable of losing-their-rag?

I think Italy will probably get about?

By my count at least 4 matches so far have been on the issuing of a red card.

Speaking of which, wasn't Kewell just adorable after his goalline save against Ghana? What did he reckon Rosetti would have done if he had in fact looked up at the replay on?

I just hope we don;t get done by more than Aussie did against Germany.

Aw, shuddup!

I can try a little summary...

That's brilliant Gio, thanks for that! Brown the Kiwi Pirlo eh? Awesome.

Aw, shuddup!

s'ok, it dint hex ...........the first half anyway.

Divided loyalties, here I come!

Well, that worked out for you, didn't it? :)

But really, they couldn't afford a loss, so they couldn't risk putting enough men up to break the wall of eight. And great tactic to throw everyone forward when we got a penalty?

Preamble Afternoon. Italy may traditionally be the suave sophisticates of world football, bestriding the scene with an imperious elegance and in a suit so sharp that it should be illegal, yet when it comes to the World Cup they have a?

Our 8 year old summed up the Italian game nicely I thought. 'Drama queens!'

*Note it is the only draw on the list.

And great tactic to throw everyone forward when we got a penalty anywhere near their half.

I love it when rugby heads talk about soccer :-)

After two games, they are on behind Italy on alphabetical order.

What a line! And what a game! It was great to see New?

and Non è solo colpa di Lippi
siamo proprio modesti...

I posted screencaps, because the score of the Brasil Cote d'Ivoire game was in a sidebar. Part 1 and part 2.

"Now we can add to our curriculum of world cup holders a draw against New Zealand, and can add our name to the list of big teams – France, England, Germany, Spain and so forth – for?

Totti as well IMO

Camoranesi was asked to play in Totti's role in the second half, which is a little like putting Rococoko at first-five.

L'Italia continua a deludere
Solo 1-1 con la Nuova Zelanda

and Non è solo colpa di Lippi
siamo proprio modesti...

We've already had to put up with good old fashioned Anglo-Saxon pluck being denied by un-manly Latin theatrics, now you telling me they don't speak English either?

Silvio Berlusconi can you hear me? Silvio Berlusconi your boys took a hell of a beating! Your boys took a hell of a beating!?

Bloody hell! Welcome to Hyperbole Central!

Heard the news on RNZ 'round 6am. First reaction was disbelief but now I am a believer. Nevertheless, it does?

NZ progresses.....

damn, so jealous of the guys over their watching and waving their shirts.?

We're going to have to start entertaining the possibility that New Zealand will advance to the second stage.

What form should this entertainment take for maximal effect? Something tasteful to avoid sapping the moral fibre, but nevertheless inspiring?

good old fashioned Anglo-Saxon pluck

Oh that's right – in the jokey vernacular employed in sports circles – some people still like to pretend and (make pathetic jokes) that the English don"t whine. And continentals are all like waving arms and ....who me?

'48 min. The second half begins as the first ended, with Italy on top and Ryan Nelsen giving an epic display of over-ma-dead-body defending.'

But how many corners and shots on goal did Italy have!

If they had applied the "every five corner you get a goal" rule, Italy would have won 4-1. Just sayin'.

If there's any justice in the world, Ryan Nelsen for one should be looking at a job upgrade to?

A high-scoring draw or a win against Paraguay, and we're through to the next round

A high-scoring draw is going to be enough only if Italy and Slovakia play to a low-scoring draw.

And I'd like to see Wood start the next game instead of Fallon, just in case we?

A high-scoring draw is going to be enough only if Italy and Slovakia play to a low-scoring draw.

True – if our result matches Italy's we need to have scored more goals than them.

And call me crazy, but if we get another referee like last night, and Fallon continues?

If you're suggesting that Herbert is going to "rest" anybody for the most important game in the history of NZ football, let me be the first to say: you're crazy.

I concur, with added arm-waving for emphasis

I wonder how rugby rates in Italy compared to football in NZ.

It's quite popular in some parts of the country, almost completely uknown in others. It's not played by kids except in those few areas, unlike soccer over here. On the other hand, Italian rugby fans don't seem to?

The consensus seems to be that while Smeltz was offside it would have been a tough to call to make

Indeed. And 84% of those who responed to the poll said so as well.

Indeed. And 84% of those who responed to the poll said so as well.

That's why it wasn't called. The referee was waiting on good polling data...

Apparently if we draw with Paraguay by the same amount as Slovakia draws with Italy then it will come down to a coin toss between us and Italy!

'ALL WHITES TAILS UP FTW'

World ends...

'ALL WHITES TAILS UP FTW'

Italy won Euro 68 like that. I shit you not. (Well, it won the semifinal on a coin toss, rather. But still)

Italy won Euro 68 like that. I shit you not.

It was a coin of two sides, and...?

[Spoiler Alert]
Seriously, in Doctor Who that would break the space time continuum, open a rift in the fabric of the Universe, and it would all be over.

it will come down to a coin toss

an Italian coin would flip itself

That's why it wasn't called. The referee was waiting on good polling data...

Democracy in action.

It was a coin of two sides

a New Zealand one would probably land on its edge

The Aussies will get over the Grosso penalty some day

I wonder if it will be before the Americans get over their disallowed goal. ESPN won't shut up about it.

especially those gained for an Oscar winning performance

Smith committed a foul, you know. It may be one of those fouls that often gets overlooked, but it was a foul nonetheless. De Rossi made sure the ref saw it. It's exactly what Smeltz would have done if it had happened?

Apparently if we draw with Paraguay by the same amount as Slovakia draws with Italy then it will come down to a coin toss between us and Italy!

Is that seriously the next thing they use to decide? Not 'least number of penalties' or something?

Smith committed a foul, you?

Brazil doesn't seem to have too much trouble blasting it into the net I've noticed.

Exactly.*

And I was about to say that at least New Zealand (particularly Ricki Herbert) has been mostly future focused and positive, but I hear Nelson may be a few coins lighter after letting rip?

In the meantime, Paraguay looked impressive against Slovakia and I think they'll be a tougher proposition for NZ than either Italy or Slovakia.

@Gio; Kewell and the video was brilliant. That?s what playing for Liverpool does to you.

BTW; what?s the bet that if it does come?

Maybe you could forgive us a little bravado, as it sort of doesn't happen, well, ever, when it?

Did it cross the line? Should it have been a red card? Was it handball? Was it offside??

Don't be mean.

Eh? We are talking sport here. We have every right to feel proud. It's a massive world competition, of which it is a survival of the fittest, test against each country of which I'll add, players leave their respective employment to represent. It is __ not __?

I recall one of your earlier spirited defences of the importance of different football philosophies – in the context of footballing 'romantics' (myself included) unnecessarily lamenting the 1982 defeat of an extravagantly gifted Brazilian team by a very pragmatic (and also very gifted) Italian team.

Forgetting then,?

BBC Team of the day, 4 Brazilians, 3 Paraguayans and 4 All Whites.
Awesome!

That's worth getting excited about, right? Four of our players were ahead of several of the top players, and most highly paid no doubt, in the world, at least by this assessment.
__

I'll add, players leave?

The consensus seems to be that while Smeltz was offside it would have been a tough to call to make

He couldn't have been offside. If he had been offside, the linesman would have put his flag up.

What a day for NZ soccer – I'm saving already for Brazil 2014.

It'll be great watching us defending our title there.

And I am also reminded of Australia and the Grosso penalty 4 years ago. At the time I recall a european friend saying that perceived footballing injustice can fuel a team and a nation for decades to come – its an important part of a relatively 'new' football nation building?

Don't be mean.... It's just not a nice thing to do.

Yeah, coz there is nothing nastier than suggesting Italy wont make it past the first round in the World Cup.

Cry me a river...

I like how Gio has turned this thread into a postmodern performance piece by cunningly emulating the dramatic behaviour of his compatriots. Bravo!

Yes, and I can't imagine he left for good either.He's probably just having a moment.or at least drinking his new bottles of wine. Rigged I say ;)

Anyway Gio; think of it this way. Rugby sides all round the world get pissed off at the way that All Black open-side flankers (well before the current master) have played the laws to the limit.?

What would probably help a bit would be all players wearing elbow?

Anyway Gio; think of it this way. Rugby sides all round the world get pissed off at the way that All Black open-side flankers (well before the current master) have played the laws to the limit.

My view is that many/most competitive athletes have a drive to 'do whatever it?

I love it when rugby heads talk about soccer :-)

My soccer coach never taught me that, dude. Though come to think of it, my soccer coach didn't seem to know much about soccer.

Anyway, I'm a motorsport fan, plus whatever's free on the tele, so rugby doesn't get much?

Gio spent a lot of time here today, translating Italian newspapers for everyone, generally trying to be good spirited about it all, even though he was probably aching a bit inside, just the way that lots of us do when the All Blacks don't even make it into the?

And Giovanni, please don't go – you'll just reinforce?

I thought the Italians totally owned the ball, even if they couldn't quite get it in the goal. Our guys practically gift-wrapped the ball and gave it away every time it came near them. Thank god?

That said

"Ow, mamma, a?

The Italian team visit Cape Town orphanage. "It's heartbreaking to see their sad little faces with no hope" said Jamal, age 6

I'd just like to say that Kyle Matthews knows his football punditry. Just saying.

Actually my comment near the end of the NZ-Slovakia game was that it would be vastly improved if there was more body checking. Seriously, passing back and forth, back to D, back to goal tender. Do?

I'd like to post the following, pinched from writer Pip Adam's twitter account:

Er... Pip is a dear friend and I'm sure she wouldn't want to be accused of plagiarism, so let's say right away it's a rather older joke – a known associate of this fine blog was making?

a known associate of this fine blog was making it about the Socceroos just last week.

Heh; I can assure you I plagiarised it too.

And here?s something else to repeat. Now that every team has played 2 matches a table can be done of all teams to date.

And?

it's a rather older joke – a known associate of this fine blog was making it about the Socceroos just last week.

I had never heard it before and actually chortled out loud.

(Righto, back to threadlurking. I know absolutely nothing about this sport and so I'm just vicariously basking?

But Italy is playing to its potential. That's the problem.

Thinking about this, and here's where I display my lack of true Football knowledge no doubt, it seems to me Italy is an excellent team of mid fielders and defenders, but lacks an expert dribbler and striker. Possibly similar to?

Are there any young talents in the squad who could be given a run?

Nah. There's a young player who wasn't selected for being a bit of a troublemaker – Balotelli – and an older one who wasn't selected for having kicked the young one in the dying stages of?

I'm no expert, but my impression is that Smeltz is a reasonable striker. Top scorer in the Australian league. Having a better world cup than some top premier league goal scorers.

Good at putting himself in a position to capitalise on a well placed aerial pass, but could he outwit?

Good at putting himself in a position to capitalise on a well placed aerial pass, but could he outwit three defenders on the dribble, then hammer one in off his left foot?

Well, getting on the end of aerial long balls is pretty much an English striker's job, and very?

Maradona was the greatest on the planet.

I haven't seen an Argentina game yet (yes yes, terrible, I know), but tonight's game against Greece should be good, at the convenient time of 6.15am. Argentina are some bookies' favourites, but not their own coach's?

But what chance of two predictions coming right in consecutive games? probably none.

As an aside on the radio sports news earlier this evening they were saying what?