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Speaker: KICK IT! The Highest Mountain, and an Ode to Robert Green

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  • giovanni tiso,

    No, but I find the needling a little boring and sad, so ciao to all.

    Wellington • Since Jun 2007 • 7315 posts Report Reply

  • Geoff Lealand,

    Don't go, Giovanni. We can learn a lot from you. I know so little about soccer--don't even know the offside rule!

    Screen & Media Studies, U… • Since Oct 2007 • 2219 posts Report Reply

  • recordari,

    I guess I'm guilty, and sorry if it was getting tiresome, or seemed personal in any way. Nothing the Italian papers haven't said already though, right? Just re-reading your page one translations.

    Maybe you could forgive us a little bravado, as it sort of doesn't happen, well, ever, when it comes to Football in New Zealand.

    Personally I hope both New Zealand and Italy win, we both go through, and everyone is happy.

    (Anyone here from Paraguay?)

    AUCKLAND • Since Dec 2009 • 2607 posts Report Reply

  • vangam,

    Dont worry - once Italy have been eliminated next week we wont need an Italian perspective anymore.

    Rangiora • Since Jun 2007 • 103 posts Report Reply

  • Deborah,

    Don't be mean. Living on this side of the Tasman, it gets a bit much being needled about NZ all the time, especially if it's something of which I'm secretly rather proud. It's just not a nice thing to do.

    Manawatu City • Since Nov 2006 • 1276 posts Report Reply

  • simon g,

    A nation has only really arrived at the World Cup when they have a proper controversy, leading to years of indignation, buttressed by photographic "evidence" and a rumour mill that's always hiring.

    Did it cross the line? Should it have been a red card? Was it handball? Was it offside? (Answers No, Yes, Yes and Yes, with reference to 1966, 1982, 1986, and 2002, respectively). There are dozens more.

    I don't think Italy's dodgy penalty and NZ's offside goal quite measure up. Not when one team is overjoyed with the result, and the other team can still qualify anyway.

    So yeah, I'm looking forward to elimination at the hands of the FIFA tosser. That would be a grievance worth nurturing.

    Giovanni, stick around. The PA Football XI is under-strength as it is.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 688 posts Report Reply

  • Martin Barry,

    Two fabulous results and football is really penetrating the NZ pysche. The Paraguay game will probably be the hardest of the three with the South American style so foreign to us.
    Mind you our style will certainly unsettle them and if we carry on creating 3 or 4 genuine chances every game we will always be in with a real chance of a result.May this golden run never end.
    And just a little icing on the cake for me :

    BBC Team of the day, 4 Brazilians, 3 Paraguayans and 4 All Whites
    Awesome!

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/football/world_cup_2010/8750355.stm

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 9 posts Report Reply

  • simon g,

    Meanwhile, One News trailers feature All Whites goalscoring hero, John Key. Yes, it's all about the politicians, that's the real story here. Vomit.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 688 posts Report Reply

  • Mike Hollywood,

    Bugger, I was enjoying Giovanni's informed comments too.

    Since May 2009 • 50 posts Report Reply

  • Sofie Bribiesca,

    Don't be mean.

    Eh? We are talking sport here. We have every right to feel proud. It's a massive world competition, of which it is a survival of the fittest, test against each country of which I'll add, players leave their respective employment to represent. It is not tea and biscuits.
    Really Deborah, I guess in an ideal world, we could all eat brioche, but it's not ideal so let's us sing the praises of our All White champions of the night, if you don't mind. :)

    here and there. • Since Nov 2007 • 5735 posts Report Reply

  • Richard Llewellyn,

    Don't go Gio

    I recall one of your earlier spirited defences of the importance of different football philosophies - in the context of footballing 'romantics' (myself included) unnecessarily lamenting the 1982 defeat of an extravagantly gifted Brazilian team by a very pragmatic (and also very gifted) Italian team.

    Forgetting then, as in all sporting contests, that there is always more than one way to skin a cat, so to speak - just ask Jose Mourinho (or even some of the more utilitarian rugby coaches in recent years when playing the All Blacks). There is an art to containing the artist and in turn employing your own strengths to good effect.

    And at the same time, the artist needs to appeciate that they cannot win by skill and virtuosity alone - each team needs a more prosaic element - or as Cantona dismissively said of an esrtwhile team-mate, a 'water carrier' (or in rugby terms a 'Jerry').

    As for genuine kiwi disappointment at perceived unfairness - some lessons in gamesmanship for all I'm sure, but its been clear for the last 6-7 world cups that FIFA has no intention of seriously addressing that side of the game - so if you can't beat em ....

    And I am also reminded of Australia and the Grosso penalty 4 years ago. At the time I recall a european friend saying that perceived footballing injustice can fuel a team and a nation for decades to come - its an important part of a relatively 'new' football nation building a lasting footballing legacy and history :)

    What a day for NZ soccer - I'm saving already for Brazil 2014.

    Mt Albert • Since Nov 2006 • 399 posts Report Reply

  • recordari,

    BBC Team of the day, 4 Brazilians, 3 Paraguayans and 4 All Whites.
    Awesome!

    That's worth getting excited about, right? Four of our players were ahead of several of the top players, and most highly paid no doubt, in the world, at least by this assessment.

    I'll add, players leave their respective employment to represent.


    I loved it when the commentators announced the last substitution 'Financial Analyst from Wellington'.

    AUCKLAND • Since Dec 2009 • 2607 posts Report Reply

  • Tom Semmens,

    The consensus seems to be that while Smeltz was offside it would have been a tough to call to make

    He couldn't have been offside. If he had been offside, the linesman would have put his flag up.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 1711 posts Report Reply

  • Yamis,

    What a day for NZ soccer - I'm saving already for Brazil 2014.

    It'll be great watching us defending our title there.

    Since Nov 2006 • 855 posts Report Reply

  • Martin Barry,

    Gio, let me join the team in wishing you back, I always enjoy your comments, whatever the topic.
    And remember 82, the Azzurri started with 3 draws and won the tournament, I was lucky enough to be there for all their games from the 2nd round onwards and love Italian football and fans.

    Forza Italia and Forza All Whites :)

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 9 posts Report Reply

  • George Darroch,

    And I am also reminded of Australia and the Grosso penalty 4 years ago. At the time I recall a european friend saying that perceived footballing injustice can fuel a team and a nation for decades to come - its an important part of a relatively 'new' football nation building a lasting footballing legacy and history :)

    Oh, they're still upset about that here.

    For what it's worth these things do make for a more difficult contest to watch, but things are what they are, and as Richard said, it's not going to change. Just like doping and cycling - it's not always a fair contest, but it's still enjoyable to watch.

    The People's Republic of … • Since Nov 2006 • 2079 posts Report Reply

  • vangam,

    Don't be mean.... It's just not a nice thing to do.

    Yeah, coz there is nothing nastier than suggesting Italy wont make it past the first round in the World Cup.

    Cry me a river...

    Rangiora • Since Jun 2007 • 103 posts Report Reply

  • Sacha,

    I like how Gio has turned this thread into a postmodern performance piece by cunningly emulating the dramatic behaviour of his compatriots. Bravo!

    Ak • Since May 2008 • 15762 posts Report Reply

  • Sofie Bribiesca,

    I like how Gio has turned this thread into a postmodern performance piece by cunningly emulating the dramatic behaviour of his compatriots. Bravo!

    Yes, and I can't imagine he left for good either.He's probably just having a moment.or at least drinking his new bottles of wine. Rigged I say ;)

    here and there. • Since Nov 2007 • 5735 posts Report Reply

  • Sacha,

    laughing it up in a cafe somewhere

    Ak • Since May 2008 • 15762 posts Report Reply

  • LegBreak,

    I'd just like to say that Kyle Matthews knows his football punditry. Just saying.

    Anyway Gio; think of it this way. Rugby sides all round the world get pissed off at the way that All Black open-side flankers (well before the current master) have played the laws to the limit.

    That's how we've always played it, we're good at it, and so be it.

    Italian football is much the same.

    For what it's worth what's annoyed me more over the years with Italian sides is the sitting back on early leads. Fortunately, that didn't happen last night; it was a great spectacle.

    Wellington • Since Nov 2006 • 1162 posts Report Reply

  • Yamis,

    Michael Jones wasn't reknowned for cheating at the breakdown was he? More for beautiful running, passing and smashing tackles. Kronfeld on the other hand dipped his hands in there a bit more. McCaw is a master of it.

    What would probably help a bit would be all players wearing elbow pads like skateboarders, helmets with face protectors and rather than wearing shirts your teams colours are painted on.

    I bet there was no shirt pulling in that nude rugby game in the weekend. Though there may have been some tackles tackled.

    Since Nov 2006 • 855 posts Report Reply

  • Richard Llewellyn,

    Anyway Gio; think of it this way. Rugby sides all round the world get pissed off at the way that All Black open-side flankers (well before the current master) have played the laws to the limit.

    My view is that many/most competitive athletes have a drive to 'do whatever it takes' to win a contest. That means they will inevitably push the laws or the adjudicator to the limit to seek an edge.

    The notion of 'spirit of the game' is somewhat of an anachronism that people mistakenly cling to only because it still remains possible to win contests with overwhelming skill or power on the upside, with the 'bending the rules' only needed on the downside risk.

    If we as sport-lovers want to preserve the notion of a 'spirit' or a pure ideal of how to play a particular sport, rather than look to the players we'd be better off to look to the law-makers. Introduce more risk of penalty to a team for pushing the rules, and behaviour will surely change.

    All fairly obvious I know, so why does the fiefdom of Blatter (or indeed the IRB) not take fairly rational steps to minimise the less attractive side of the game? What preserves the status quo?

    Mt Albert • Since Nov 2006 • 399 posts Report Reply

  • tussock,

    I love it when rugby heads talk about soccer :-)

    My soccer coach never taught me that, dude. Though come to think of it, my soccer coach didn't seem to know much about soccer.

    Anyway, I'm a motorsport fan, plus whatever's free on the tele, so rugby doesn't get much of a look in these days. Not seeing much of this world cup either. :shrug:

    Since Nov 2006 • 338 posts Report Reply

  • Deborah,

    Not.Impressed.

    Gio spent a lot of time here today, translating Italian newspapers for everyone, generally trying to be good spirited about it all, even though he was probably aching a bit inside, just the way that lots of us do when the All Blacks don't even make it into the semis, and when he said, actually guys, I can't manage this anymore, no one let up. It must be possible to celebrate the New Zealand draw, without at the same time making nasty comments about the Italians.

    C'mon everyone. How about looking after a member of this community, especially someone who has so freely given his expertise to enable us to celebrate? Would it really hurt you to do so?

    Also, even if the Italian player dived to make it blatantly obvious, it was still a foul. Also, also, the NZ goal was kind of dodgy too. Also, also, also, wasn't the result fair enough? It's still an amazing result for NZ, and one we will celebrate for years to come.

    Best of all, we're doing better than the Aussies.

    Manawatu City • Since Nov 2006 • 1276 posts Report Reply

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