Hard News by Russell Brown

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Hard News: The Clamour to Cringe

98 Responses

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  • Emma Hart,

    Then it really will carry all the hallmarks of an addictive drug, better than sex...

    Dude, one of us is doing SOMETHING wrong.

    Christchurch • Since Nov 2006 • 4285 posts Report Reply

  • BenWilson,

    Hmmm. I think Ben and I have to link pinky fingers and say 'jinx' before we can post again...

    My goodness. I'll bamp to that.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 8015 posts Report Reply

  • Testcard,

    I get it.

    Bamping is New Zealand's answer to krumping.

    Sweet.

    Since Nov 2007 • 23 posts Report Reply

  • Ben Austin,

    Derail: New Wikipedia scandal -Prepare for soul searching news stories about it and Web 2.0.

    London • Since Nov 2006 • 861 posts Report Reply

  • linger,

    Wow, I thought, so many comments on NZ education already!
    ... but it turns out it's just one bamping after another ...

    Tokyo • Since Apr 2007 • 808 posts Report Reply

  • BenWilson,

    Dude, one of us is doing SOMETHING wrong.

    :-) Reminds me of an old gf when I told her Schwarzenegger once claimed pumping iron was better than sex. She said "He must have really bad sex".

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 8015 posts Report Reply

  • JP Hansen,

    Bamping is New Zealand's answer to krumping.

    No no, NZ's answer to Krumping is Crumping.

    Waitakere • Since Nov 2006 • 199 posts Report Reply

  • FletcherB,

    No no, NZ's answer to Krumping is Crumping.

    Is that like, telling tall tales in a slow drawl, driving Toyota pick-up trucks, and making fun of short blonde men called Scotty?

    West Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 782 posts Report Reply

  • Neil Morrison,

    Iran, I don't see how it's possible to be the least bit sure about any of the claims by intelligence agencies about anything.

    to be sure, but given that this latest NIE on Iran is substantially different to that in 2005 it does suggest they have based this on what they believe to be good new intelligence. They could possibly be be wrong or lying - which would mean that Iran still has an active nuclear programme. But I really do think that the combined US intelliegnce agencies wouldn't be sitting on that just to make Bush look bad, whatever Podhoretz's conspiracy theories.

    Since Nov 2006 • 932 posts Report Reply

  • JP Hansen,

    Hmm. My couple-of-hours-old thread on "Kiwi Bamping" at my favoured messageboard (yes, a Star Wars one, I am a geek) now outranks Scoop's story in a 'Kiwi Bamping' google search and is sitting pretty at number 1.

    I really feel like I've achieved something today.

    Waitakere • Since Nov 2006 • 199 posts Report Reply

  • noizyboy,

    Derail: New Wikipedia scandal -Prepare for soul searching news stories about it and Web 2.0.

    Man, what has the Register got against Wikipedia exactly? Do they have a 'one-anti-Wikipedia-article-a-month' policy or something?

    To quote the Register in this instance...

    ...a rogue editor revealed that the site's top administrators are using a secret insider mailing list to crackdown on perceived threats to their power.

    Or, to put in less 'shock-horror' terms, a few of the senior editors have a 'private' mailing list where they discuss issues to do with the site. Surely this is stunningly non-controversial.

    wellington • Since Nov 2006 • 171 posts Report Reply

  • Lyndon Hood,

    I'd replaced the zeitgeist story with a (they say) changed version of the google release before I saw about the bamping. I had a look in case I was going to have to rain on the whole parade, but it's still there.

    Let's bamp, bampers.

    Wellington • Since Nov 2006 • 1091 posts Report Reply

  • BenWilson,

    to be sure, but given that this latest NIE on Iran is substantially different to that in 2005 it does suggest they have based this on what they believe to be good new intelligence.

    Maybe. Or maybe nothing has changed except the attraction of being made to look incompetent by the actions of a moronic lame duck president with the worlds greatest arsenal at his fingertips, and a lot to hide, cover up, and answer for, and no track record of ever accepting blame personally. How would we ever know? Given that this is a 180 degree flipflop, is it really rational to move from high certainty that Iran is working on the bomb to high certainty that they destroyed the whole project 4 years ago? Did what happened 4 years ago change in the last couple of days?

    For them to have been so completely hoodwinked into thinking Iran was working on the bomb,despite all protestations from Iran to the contrary, and the sheer scale and risk of such a project, implies that there's just a hell of a lot of "making shit up" involved in all this awesome "intelligence". We can choose to eat it up or start to become skeptical about everything they say.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 8015 posts Report Reply

  • Neil Morrison,

    We can choose to eat it up or start to become skeptical about everything they say.

    you might be right but i think if the NIE assessment turns out to be wrong then it's more likely to be an honest mistake than some sort of skulduggery (a view based purely on not much). Certainly Ehud Barak thinks its wrong and Simon Tisdall concludes his piece with

    The irony here, amusing if it were not so deadly serious, is that having been badly wrong about Iraq, a chastened intelligence community, erring on the side of caution, may also be wrong about Iran.

    But for the time being I'll take the unjustifiably optimistic view that Iran did respond to international pressure and that for all the bluster on both sides this is all heading for a negotiated settlement.

    Since Nov 2006 • 932 posts Report Reply

  • Joanna,

    __...a rogue editor revealed that the site's top administrators are using a secret insider mailing list to crackdown on perceived threats to their power.__

    Or, to put in less 'shock-horror' terms, a few of the senior editors have a 'private' mailing list where they discuss issues to do with the site. Surely this is stunningly non-controversial.

    I hear there's this website that's all about Wellington that has the same kind of secret organisational tactic going on. We must out it! Make them go public with their ageist agendas and secret snark attacks and gossipy incliques and cliches!

    Wellington • Since Nov 2006 • 718 posts Report Reply

  • Don Christie,

    and with all due respect, I don't give a shit about Australia.

    Maybe you should let all your mates over at Kiwiblog and in the National party know, Craig. With all due respect, of course.

    Wellington • Since Nov 2006 • 1612 posts Report Reply

  • BenWilson,

    it's more likely to be an honest mistake than some sort of skulduggery (a view based purely on not much).

    Either way they are proving their complete unreliability as a source of information.

    I tend to think that intelligence agencies would be more prone than most institutions to groupthink. Academic communities thrive in a world of open information, repeatable discoveries and robust debate, but none of these is a possibility for the spook world. You're talking about information that is tainted by secrecy, political motives, monetary motives, torture, counter-intelligence, fear, ideology. Nothing about this lends itself to the truth being accessible.

    For instance, say this amazing intel is from some agent working in Iran? What's to say they aren't a double-agent? Or it's an Iranian double-agent that's been turned. Can we be sure they aren't a double-double-agent? Or perhaps it's just opportunists selling info to the highest bidder, who don't actually have any real intel at all. Maybe it's some covert team who have penetrated an abandoned nuke project? Who can say it just hasn't been moved?

    All I can see from the outside is a flipflop. It's an insult to my intelligence to suggest that it is the facts that have flipflopped. 1984 has been and gone. The fairest I could be is to say that they can't have been that certain in the first place.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 8015 posts Report Reply

  • Neil Morrison,

    ...say this amazing intel is from some agent working in Iran? What's to say they aren't a double-agent?

    it does seem that that's what was initially thought - that the intercepted communications were a scam. Seems that's why the NIE publication was delayed - so they could verify the intelligence. It could still be that iran is gaming but it does appear that this was considered.

    But if the NIE is wrong then my guess is that this will all come out during the term of the next president who will most likely be a Dem with a More of the Carrot and Less of the Stick policy compared to Bush. Now if Iran is gaming this then just think what reponse such a president would make - most likely go back to more of the stick and for real this time.

    Since Nov 2006 • 932 posts Report Reply

  • BenWilson,

    It could still be that iran is gaming but it does appear that this was considered.

    The same comment applies before the "new information". It is quite possible that it's a game Iran is very good at. Given the flipflop I'd even say it's likely. Either they're good at hiding their weapons project, or they're good at hiding that they don't have one. I don't feel confident about either fact, and just conclude they are good at hiding stuff.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 8015 posts Report Reply

  • Kyle Matthews,

    For instance, say this amazing intel is from some agent working in Iran? What's to say they aren't a double-agent? Or it's an Iranian double-agent that's been turned. Can we be sure they aren't a double-double-agent? Or perhaps it's just opportunists selling info to the highest bidder, who don't actually have any real intel at all. Maybe it's some covert team who have penetrated an abandoned nuke project? Who can say it just hasn't been moved?

    You'd like to think that professional intelligence services with multi gazillion dollar budgets would be fairly good at sniffing such things out. Seeking other independent sources, physical evidence which backs up what they've been told. Just plain knowing when they've been lied to.

    Of course, you'd _like_ to think that, the reality of the American intelligence service over the past few years however...

    Since Nov 2006 • 6145 posts Report Reply

  • Michael Savidge,

    "Fuck!!" (in Persian of course)

    Iranians speak Farsi redneck...

    Somewhere near Wellington… • Since Nov 2006 • 310 posts Report Reply

  • Kyle Matthews,

    "Fuck!!" (in Persian of course)

    Iranians speak Farsi redneck...

    I'm no expert on the topic, but at least according to Wikipedia you should check things out before you open your mouth. Particularly if you're going to be y'know, rude about it. Farsi and Persian seems to mean the same thing.

    Since Nov 2006 • 6145 posts Report Reply

  • Steve Barnes,

    I have it on good authority that some people think that Iran is inhabited by cute pink fluffy bunnies. This information may, of course be wrong. Some of those bunnies may be vicious.
    On the other hand Iran might be developing nuclear power generation so as to conserve their stocks of oil for future generations and we can't have that can we? America has a right to plunder the wealth of other nations.

    The wireless north ;-) • Since Dec 2006 • 4452 posts Report Reply

  • Luke Williamson,

    "Well, there's still plenty to cringe about - and with all due respect, I don't give a shit about Australia. But it's also fair enough to give credit where credit's due."

    To hark right back to the beginning - couldn't agree more with this sentiment. I am so sick of hearing John Key/National/NZ Herald comparing us to Australia. Do they think that everyone in Aussie sits around comparing themselves and the latest statistics to NZ? The only real similarities between the countries are that we are somewhere in the South Pacific. Same goes for constant comparisons to how well Ireland is doing. Yeah! NZ is so like Ireland.
    I think NZ is a bloody interesting place to be right now - far enough away from the rest of the world to be doing our own thing, but close enough to export it if we need to.

    Warkworth • Since Oct 2007 • 234 posts Report Reply

  • James Bremner,

    Maybe things aren't going so badly after all?

    Tell that to all the dead people's families. In person. Make a tape, put it on You Tube. I'd really love to see it.

    You really ought to be making a request to Al Qaeda and Moqti et al terrorists & insurgents etc. to make a video on You Tube to apologize for the all the homicide bombings and murder and mayhem that they inflicted on Iraqis over the last few years. They killed, deliberately, a hell of a lot more people, and are thus responsible for the displacement etc, than the MNF killed, and any civilians the MNF killed, were killed by accident. There is no moral relativity there at all.

    NOLA • Since Nov 2006 • 341 posts Report Reply

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