Posts by Craig Young
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No, Greg, that's 'consensual adult' incest, which I'm profoundly sceptical about. For a very good reason- it tends to resultg from genetical sexual attraction, an unforeseen side effect of adult adoption information reforms in the eighties. It means that previously seperated adopted out adult children, and adult children and their parents, haven't experienced the normal developmental processes that inhibit incest between siblings or children and parents. Most of that appears to occur in (illegal) monogamous relationships, such as the highly problematic Stuebing case in Germany, recently rebuffed by the European Court of Human Rights.
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And while we're waiting for Moz's reply to that, here's a little background on why the Christains are being sneaky and duplicitous about their own polygamist past. You see, it all started with Martin Luther...
What, Martin Luther, the very founder of Protestant Christianity himself- and an advocate of polygamy. What?!! Yes, that is correct. Luther believed that polygamous marriages were preferable to extramarital sex (or 'fornication') or adultery. Indeed, Luther and Phillip Melancthon, another early Lutheran theologian and pivotal figure, advocated that Phillip, Landgrave of Hesse (a German principality within the Holy Roman Empire) covertly and bigamously marry two women- Christine of Saxony, an invalid and alcoholic, and one of her ladies-in-waiting, Margarethe van der Saale. However, it doesn't end there. Instead of divorcing Catherine of Aragon, his first wife, Melanchthon also advised future serial monogamist Henry VIII to bigamously marry Anne Boleyn. Henry didn't take his advice, divorced Catherine instead and monogamously remarried Anne, future mother of Elizabeth I of England.
(Meanwhile, Henry VIII also theoretically criminalised gay male sex within the Buggery Act 1540 at the same time, although there were few criminal prosecutions for it until the advent of the first "Christian Right," the eighteenth century Societies for the Reformation of Manners).
However, Phillip of Hesse did take Melanchthon's advice and covertly married Margarethe in 1539. Amusingly, Phillip's sister Elizabeth couldn't keep quiet about her brother's multiple marriages, embarrassing Luther and Melanchthon seriously when she blabbed about it a year later. Altogether, both Margarethe and Christine provided Phillip of Hesse with nineteen children, so infertility wasn't a problem in that dynastic context.
Nor were German Lutheran princes the only ones to undertake polygamy. Take Michael Kramer, a hapless Saxony Lutheran minister, and his multiple marriages. In 1525, the Lukas Town Council noted that the man had three living wives, although two of them had abandoned the poor fellow. He contacted Luther who counselled him to consider his two undivorced prior wives, Dorothea and Margaretha, 'spiritually dead" to him and contract a third marriage. Shortly afterward, in 1533-34, the Lutheran hierarchy would officially condemn the polygamist commune of Munster, occupied by theocratic revolutionary Anabaptists (a radical Protestant sect). Lutheran marital theology was still in flux at the time and working out whether or not it condoned divorce, and under what circumstances.
This provided wives of Lutheran clerics with escape clauses if the marriages earlier contracted turned out to be unsuitable or distasteful to them, which unfortunately happened quite frequently.To be fair to the Lutherans, they weren't the only Protestants with these problems. Calvinist Geneva was scandalised when Bernardino Ochino published a Dialogue on Polygamy in 1563. They expelled poor Bernardino and his children from the Swiss canton, and three of the latter starved to death. Nor was this an isolated instance- celebrated English Puritan author John Milton, author of Paradise Lost, also defended polygamy in De Doctrinae Christianae in 1673, dictated to another after the author went blind and published posthumously.
Nor did Lutheranism itself calm down after the passage of the Carolina (1532), German civil law that criminalised undivorced remarriages as bigamy and mandated divorce as the solution for unsuitable prior marriages, much to the anguish of Martin Luther himself. Unfortunately, in the seventeenth century, Johann Lyser wrote three polemical treatises that advocated polygamy and was forced to seek the protection of a sympathetic count. On that prince's death, Lyser was forced to flee to Hanover, where he was imprisoned, Italy and ultimately, the Netherlands. Destitute, he died in an Amsterdam garret in 1682, worn out by his ordeals.
The eighteenth century witnessed similar theological radicalism- English Methodist Michael Madan (1726-1790) wrote a book entitled Thelyphthora, another defence of polygamy- much to the horror of other early evangelical Methodists. In Poland, Samuel Friedrich Willenburg wrote yet another volume on the subject, but the King of Poland ordered it incinerated in 1715.
Nor has conservative Christian tolerance of polygamy evaporated completely today. Nigeria and Uganda have both been at the forefront of antigay African fundamentalist activity during the last decade, criminalising same-sex marriage in the case of Nigeria and threatening 'unrepentant' lesbians and gay men with death or imprisonment within Uganda's notorious Anti-Homosexuality Bill. Straight polygamy is perfectly legal in both societies, and not only practised within Muslim communities. The Nigerian Celestial Church of Christ condones polygamy, as does the Lutheran Church of Liberia. Uganda last tried to criminalise polygamy in 2005, but abandoned the attempt that year due to Muslim opposition- much to the anger of Ugandan feminists, who regard polygamy as a violent and misogynist practise. Nor has Uganda criminalised marital rape, for that matter.
I realise that some conservative Christians may object to my account above, arguing that I have welded together fragmentary accounts into a cohesive 'tradition' of polygamy advocacy within Christian early modern history. However, I would respond that if Bob McCoskrie can similarly do so with ephemeral and transient isolated pressure groups and selective focus on isolated Canadian Law Commission reports, as opposed to Canadian case law, which upheld Section 293 of the Canadian Criminal Code in the British Columbian Supreme Court in November 2011, he should realise that turnabout is fair play.
How can same-sex monogamous marriage possibly 'lead' to recognition of polygamy when there is an undeniable Christian historical tradition of far stronger polygamous advocacy which considerably precedes it?
Recommended:
John Cairncross: After Polygamy was Made a Sin: A Social History of Christian Polygamy: London: Routledge: 1974.
Eels Hastings: Attitudes of Martin Bucer toward the Bigamy of Philip of Hesse: Brooklyn: AMS Press: 2004.
Paul Robinson: Martin Luther- A Life Reformed: New York: Longman: 2010.
Marjorie Plummer: "The Much Married Michael Kramer: Evangelical Clergy and Bigamy in Ernestine Saxony: 1522-1542" in Robin Barnes and Marjorie Plummer (eds) Cultural Margins in Early Modern Germany: Farnham: Ashgate: 2009 (pgs 99-116).
Freethinkers and Fanatics: http://www.djmacadam.com/fanatics.html
Thelyphthora: http://www.phelyphthora.com
Philip Jenkin: "One man one woman?" Christian Century: 26.01.2010: http://www.readperiodicals.com/201001/1950523351.html#ixzz26P8vHyUr
http://www.readperiodicals.com/201001/1950523351.html#ixzz26P8KwB8DPaul Vallely: "What's the History of Polygamy and How Serious a Problem is It in Africa?" Independent 06.01.2010: http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/africa/the-big-question-whats-the-history-of-polygamy-and-how-serious-a-problem-is-it-in-africa-1858858.html
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Well, I'm not bi, but I consider myself reasonably well informed about polyamory. But it's a good question- what about polyfidelity? How practical is it? How challenging is it?
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I can't claim to be a barrister or solicitor, but my understanding of the current New Zealand legal situation is as follows. Under the New Zealand Crimes Act 1961, it is illegal to engage in a non-monogamous or bigamous marriage within New Zealand territorial confines (Section 205). Moreover, this is based on the perennial Hyde versus Hyde case (1866), which ruled that the polygamous marriage of a former Mormon and his ‘plural’ wife was not recognised under British law. In the context of New Zealand, Hassan versus Hassan (1978) remains the relevant case law in the context of polygamous marriages contracted overseas.
As for polyandry, I may be helpful here too. Polyandry is about a woman espousing multiple men. It is practised in the Irigwe community of Northern Nigeria, the Masai African tribal community, Bhutan, some Sri Lankan ethnic communities, Rajasthan, Ladakh and Zanskar (India). In Canada’s Sasketchewan province, it is permissible under family law. Now, apart from India and Sri Lanka, none of the above are significant immigration sources for New Zealanders and there isn’t an organised national or international pressure group pressing for the recognition of polyandrous relationships.
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Moz, what's the debate like within the bisexual community? Other bifolk have told me that it's between serial monogamists and polyamorists. The serial monogamist contingent seem to support (deep breath) monogamous civil marriage equality because it will mean that their own same-sex relationships will be entitled to equal recognition.
I do regard bans on greater polyamorist spousal rights as biphobia. However, as I've said above, there has to be much greater homework when it comes to social scientific and psychological research when it comes to that issue than is currently available. Speaking of which...
In Atlanta, Elisabeth Sheff, a sociologist, has studied polyamorous families in detail since the nineties.Within polyamorous relationships, female participants share sexual power more equally with men – because women value interpersonal relationships and emotional contact with their sexual partners, and find new ones more easily, which gives them leverage within their relationships.Earlier this year, Canadian Simon Fraser sociologist Melissa Mitchell carried out an Internet survey of 1,100 polyamorists – the largest academic survey of polyamorists to date. She found that most polyamorist individuals (64 per cent) have two partners. Sixty one per cent of the women identified their two closest partners as both men and eighty six per cent of men identified their two closest partners as both women.
Most of the women in the sample identified as bisexual (at sixty-eight per cent), while bisexual men were less frequent (only thirty nine per cent) and exclusive lesbians or gay men were rare (only four percent identified as lesbians and three percent identified as gay men).
Polyamorists spend more time with and feel more committed to their primary partners than their secondary partners, according to Sheff’s survey. However, they may also find that secondary partners are more amenable to their sexual needs. Seventy per cent of the sample live with their primary partner and forty-seven per cent are married to them. The average relationship duration was nine years for primary partners and three years for secondary partners.
The Canadian survey is self-selected, so it cannot provide a representative sample, but Sheff says the Simon Fraser University results line up with those of other studies, such as seventy-one focus group interviews that she made with Midwestern and Californian polyamorists over a thirteen year period (1996-2009). Sheff also notes that despite the importance of feminism to polyamorists, it’s not unusual for straight men to become involved because they believe that it will lead to “easy sex” or sex with more than one woman. However, straight or bisexual male swingers tend to have a difficult time meeting the emotional demands of polyamory and are either turned off – or ostracised – by polyfidelity as a social norm within polyamorous relationships
“Ongoing poly relationships can be enough of a challenge, and require so much communication, that there is often less sex than talking. If the men come in thinking, ‘This is going to be a big free-for-all,’ and they’re not willing to put in the effort to maintaining the relationship part of it, they get a bad reputation.”
According to a growing body of research, the community consists of white professionals and college students. Ninety per cent of the respondents to Ms. Mitchell’s study were Caucasian-identified, and ninety-five per cent had some access to higher education. Amongst Sheff’s interview participants, eighty-nine per cent were white, three-quarters were in professional employment and two-thirds had at least a bachelor’s degree.
According to a 2011 polyamorist literature survey by Sheff and Corie Hammers, racial and class data on polyamorists and related groups was compiled from thirty six independent studies, and confirmed that sexual minorities largely consist of upper-middle-class Caucasians. Sheff concludes that lower socio-economic class individuals and people of colour cannot usually afford to take the risks associated with defying social norms, which could lead to employment, accomodation, parental or other forms of discrimination against polyamorists, given that legal protection is particularly scarce for polyamorists. This provides community participation advantages for those with the financial resources to hire legal assistance.
On the other hand, some individuals and families may participate covertly within non-monogamous relationships, but refuse to consider “coming out” and adopting an identity that could lead to further stigmatisation or experiences of discrimination. This is one of the reasons it is hard to estimate the scale of the US polyamorist community– researchers are unsure about operational definitions in this context.
Once again, here's a useful Canadian piece on the subject...
Jeff Fraser: “Polyamory: Three or Four or Five’s Company” Globe and Mail: 22.09.2012: http://www.theglobeandmail.com/life/relationships/polyamory-threes-or-fours-or-fives-company/article4560587/service=mobile
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In terms of LGBT political priorities, though, we have other ones to contemplate- most obviously, the further expansion of the Human Rights Act to directly encompass gender identity, with an omnibus bill or subsidiary clauses within ancillary legislation to iron out issues like transwomen prisoners being kept in male gender inappropriate prisons while transitioning, remaining issues of official document gender reconciliation, best practise standards of pre-operative and post-operative care, transgender youth needs within the education system, transphobic bullying etc. All of Australia's states and territories have already got trans-inclusive antidiscrimination laws, so we're dragging the chain on that one.
Then there's amending Section 204C (bans female genital mutilation) of the Crimes Act to include informed consent requirements for early infantile forced sex reassignment surgery in the case of intersexed infants. Or to ban the practise?
To all intents and purposes, until and unless an issue like induced human parthenogenesis comes along (although it may not be scientifically feasible), the LG section of LGBT rights have had most of our needs dealt with, so now we need to concentrate on the BTI elements.
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I think the reason that I have problems with polygamous relationships (as opposed to polyamorous ones, which are inclusive, egalitarian, consensual and nonviolent due to their involvement of bisexual and straight feminist women at their core) is because patriarchal polygynous forms of polygamy tend to involve spousal violence and child sexual abuse.
In a recent Canadian case, which debated whether or not British Columbia and Canada should strike down Section 293 of the Canadian Criminal Code under the religious freedom guarantees of the Charter of Rights and Freedoms, Justice Robert Bauman found that the risk of escalated spousal violence and instances of pedophile 'child marriage' justified keeping polygamy illegal. Citing evidence from the Canadian Polyamory Advocacy organisation, though, he distinguished polygamy from polyamory, so the latter isn't illegal.
The CPAA applauded the decision, and has said it'll probably take a breather before working on polyamorist spousal rights. Even advanced jurisdictions with full civil marriage equality for monogamous same-sex spouses don't have polyamorist spousal rights movements yet. It'll probably take ten to fifteen years to generate enough social scientific and psychological research to buttress any case for spousal equality in the context of polyamorous relationships.
I'm open to the concept of polyamorist spousal rights, but it's up to the bisexual community and their straight and LGT allies to mobilise a mass movement and do the neccessary legislative lobbying, judicial case argument and enable social scientific and psychological research into their relationships to do so.
However, that shouldn't delay monogamous civil marriage for LGBT couples now.
Useful websites:
Reference re: Section 293 of the Criminal Code of Canada:2011 British Columbia Supreme Court 1588 CanLii: http://canlii.ca/en/bc/bcsc/ doc/2011/2011bcsc1588/ 2011bcsc1588.html
Canadian Polyamory Advocacy Association: http://www.polyadvocacy.ca
Jeff Fraser: “Polyamory: Three or Four or Five’s Company” Globe and Mail: 22.09.2012: http://www.theglobeandmail.com/life/relationships/polyamory-threes-or-fours-or-fives-company/article4560587/service=mobile
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Why the hell do political journalists continually turn to John Tamihere for comments about a party that he hasn't belonged to for the last decade or so and which he continually and relentlessly sledges at every available opportunity? Or for that matter, Chris Trotter, who wouldn't know a social democrat if one bit him on the arse?
Craig Y
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Ye gods. It looks as if the fundies are transitioning from targeting LGBTs as their preferred object of the Three Minutes Hate session to Muslims, with conspiratorial sentiments that similarly attribute the Downfall of Western Civilisation to them. I recommend Martha Nussbaum, the excellent US philosopher, as a corrective to these diatribes.
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As for the raving right, they seem to be utterly without clue on this issue. Take the current rhetoric about polygamy and incest, for instance. McCrockoshite pontificates about them endlessly when he's within microphone range, but Canada refused to decriminalise polygamy after the Bountiful case (it involved a fundamentalist schismatic "Mormonoid" colony which was characterised by violence against 'plural wives' and pedophile child marriages and sexual abuse) after British Columbia held a reference case in November 2011.
As for 'consensual adult' incest, Germany's Federal Constitutional Court and the European Court of Human Rights refused to decriminalise that form of incest because (obviously) 'consensual' sibling incest is questionable if one of the parties has some form of cognitive, intellectual or behavioural disability, as well as the fact that two of the children born to the sibling couple had severe intellectual and physical disabilities.
And as for 'religious freedom,' if they think LGBT activists will deliberately dress badly, muss up our hair, dumb down and demand to be married in fundamentalist churches, nope...any more than we want to be ordained as ministers within such sects.
Craig Y