Cracker by Damian Christie

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Cracker: Go Figure

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  • George Darroch,

    Either we need to change our flag... or Australians are stupid. Let the debate begin.

    If these people get their way, there will be no confusion between the two flags.

    The current Australian flag is BORING and UNORIGINAL.
    ...
    Everyone is always saying how super laid back Australians are, and what's more laid back than not caring enough about your flag that you change it to a giant dick?

    The campaign to Change the Australian Flag to Giant Dick.

    Personally, I think the NZ flag debate is going nowhere because everything we're ever presented with is such dire rubbish.

    WLG • Since Nov 2006 • 2264 posts Report Reply

  • FletcherB,

    Either we need to change our flag... or Australians are stupid.

    It does not need to be an either/or proposition.... both statements could be true simultaneously.

    :)

    West Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 887 posts Report Reply

  • Kyle Matthews,

    It does not need to be an either/or proposition.... both statements could be true simultaneously.

    Look, that's no way to start a "serious debate"!

    Since Nov 2006 • 6243 posts Report Reply

  • Sacha,

    Eddie at teh Standard is convinced the flag malarky is a conspiracy to distract:

    Does anyone else think it’s a coincidence that Granny Herald has tried to start a meaningless debate over the national flag – ‘11 of 18 Order of NZ members support change!’ wow-wee – just as the wheels come off a flagship National policy?

    Ak • Since May 2008 • 19680 posts Report Reply

  • Craig Ranapia,

    Eddie at teh Standard is convinced the flag malarky is a conspiracy to distract:

    Someone needs to come up with A Unified Field Theory to explain Mutually Re-enforcing Traditional Media/Blog Stupidity.

    North Shore, Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 12370 posts Report Reply

  • Islander,

    Kia ora tatou- I've just suggested - via a letter-to-the-editor at the Harold, that

    replacing the black upperfield of the tinorakatirataka flag with Pacific blue (a colour that is neither turquoise nor navy but combines those elements of our ocean)

    would make us all a bloody good flag-

    acknowledges the first settlers
    acknowledges the second settlers
    flows

    Big O, Mahitahi, Te Wahi … • Since Feb 2007 • 5643 posts Report Reply

  • Ben Austin,

    I'm not sure if this is a common feeling or not, but I couldn't care less that our flag can be confused with the Australian flag and if that is one of the main reasons stated for changing it then I shall remain unconvinced by the case for change.

    It just seems a pretty petty concern, unless someone can provide some sort of damming evidence that mad warmongers or terrorist bombers only select targets based on the basis of a crude analysis of flags.

    London • Since Nov 2006 • 1019 posts Report Reply

  • Just thinking,

    I like Hunterwassers flag but really don't see the need if we don't even have a constitution or a republic.

    That said, and just to be obstinant, we had our flag first in 1869 and a Kiwi was part of the winning team to design the Oz one for 1901.

    Better still the red stars scare Yanks

    Putaringamotu • Since Apr 2009 • 1158 posts Report Reply

  • Pete Sime,

    Who says the flag should radically different, anyway? What matters is whether citizens can distinguish their own flag and so long as people know the difference between red and white stars or can count, they should. Look at the masses of tricolors throughout Europe. Take the average Kiwi and see if they could distinguish the flag of Russia, one of the world's great powers, from that of the Netherlands or Serbia. While they're not all national flags, Wikipedia has a good gallery of flag similarities.

    Flags are really not meant to be that symbollic. We have a coat of arms for deep symbolism instead.

    Dunedin • Since Apr 2008 • 167 posts Report Reply

  • Hilary Stace,

    I'm lucky to own a flagpole, and three flags. This morning Ihave taken down the Hundertwasser one which has been up for a few days, and put up the United Tribes (I like to think my missionary ancestors had some collaborative input). My other one is the Australian aboriginal flag which is probably the most spectacular.

    Wgtn • Since Jun 2008 • 3196 posts Report Reply

  • Just thinking,

    The United Tribes flag appears on the reverse side of NZ Anglo-Boer War medals. So an official nod to it back then.
    Anyone know how many Maori went to the Boer War?

    Putaringamotu • Since Apr 2009 • 1158 posts Report Reply

  • Hilary Stace,

    Seems like many did. Good old NZhistory.net usually has the answer on questions about NZ history.

    Wgtn • Since Jun 2008 • 3196 posts Report Reply

  • Just thinking,

    We should have "Kikia te poa" (Kick the Boer) as our All Black haka when playing the Springboks.

    Putaringamotu • Since Apr 2009 • 1158 posts Report Reply

  • Just thinking,

    Pete, you're link to similar flags shows the family linkage of panArab, panAfrican and so on. As such I kind of like the union jack family linkage of the red-way.

    But we really need a few more important issues addressed first.

    Putaringamotu • Since Apr 2009 • 1158 posts Report Reply

  • philipmatthews,

    But we really need a few more important issues addressed first.

    Agreed. The flag issue is just cosmetic. And no one cares, no matter how hard the Herald tries to make them.

    Christchurch • Since Nov 2007 • 656 posts Report Reply

  • Josh Addison,

    But we really need a few more important issues addressed first.

    Ah, the catch-all excuse for never getting anything done ever...

    How many times has this "debate" come up, then petered out or dissolved into "yeah, it should change to... something... at some point..."

    Most people seem to agree the flag should change eventually, can we not just get it fucking over with? If it's the Herald who acts as the catalyst, good on them. Sure, if it really happened, we'd have to cope with them crowing about it for months on end, but at least that'd be the end of it.

    Onehunga, Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 298 posts Report Reply

  • Just thinking,

    It's a diversionary tactic. National have dropped a few balls and the Herald have brought the flag out to divert attention.

    Putaringamotu • Since Apr 2009 • 1158 posts Report Reply

  • Kumara Republic,

    A very good reason to ditch the current flag, even if those fellas are clowns.

    It's a diversionary tactic. National have dropped a few balls and the Herald have brought the flag out to divert attention.

    And on the wider issue of whitebread and media circuses...

    "Don't wanna be an Aotearoan idiot
    Don't want a nation under the new media
    And can you hear the sound of hysteria?
    The subliminal mind fuck Aotearoa"
    ...

    "Don't want to be an Aotearoan idiot
    One nation controlled by the media
    Information age of hysteria
    It's going out to idiot Aotearoa"

    The southernmost capital … • Since Nov 2006 • 5415 posts Report Reply

  • Stephen Judd,

    Last night I got home to find a mail-in survey from Chris Finlayson. I am deriving some sad pleasure from filling it out.

    Q: "How do you feel about the performance of the National goverment?"

    A: "Each passing day of ignoring people who know what they're talking about in favour of witless ideology fills me with more despair. For example, does anyone in caucus know who J M Keynes was?"

    There was no question about the flag, but there was a multichoice question that mentioned "nanny state" in one of the options. I intend to write over "nanny" with "abusive stepfather."

    Wellington • Since Nov 2006 • 3122 posts Report Reply

  • Keir Leslie,

    Most people seem to agree the flag should change eventually, can we not just get it fucking over with

    Because the current New Zealand flag is, although a bit boring, competent and dignified. Most of the alternatives are gimmicky crap out of advertiser's offices. We will likely keep whatever the flag changes to for several centuries. We should take our time over it, and not rush around because the Herald wants a sales boost.

    Since Jul 2008 • 1452 posts Report Reply

  • Sacha,

    I understand why flags are important but they just don't do anything for me. Same with anthems. Not to say I wouldn't prefer we had a far cooler one of each.

    Now about those record rates of joblessness and unemployment..

    Ak • Since May 2008 • 19680 posts Report Reply

  • Sacha,

    Each passing day of ignoring people who know what they're talking about in favour of witless ideology fills me with more despair

    Nice

    Ak • Since May 2008 • 19680 posts Report Reply

  • Just thinking,

    While they're at it, there's Milton Keynes and the Redway (somehow I suspect this won't find favour) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Milton_Keynes_redway_system

    Putaringamotu • Since Apr 2009 • 1158 posts Report Reply

  • Craig Ranapia,

    It's a diversionary tactic. National have dropped a few balls and the Herald have brought the flag out to divert attention.

    Oh please... You do realise what day it is tomorrow -- the lead of the Herald story will give you a clue.

    The flag non-issue gets trotted out the first week of February every damn year, but on the bright side at least we've been spared the traditional barrage of pre-Waitangi Day "the niggers are revolting (I know they are, Carruthers, but what's that dreadful row?)" stories.

    Perhaps New Zealand has grown up a lot more, and more substantively, than The Herald thinks? Much as this blurt of fatuous faux-patriotism annoys me (enough to be the subject of my first PA Radio piece of the year), it's preferable to fatuous and toxic race-baiting.

    North Shore, Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 12370 posts Report Reply

  • Josh Addison,

    We should take our time over it, and not rush around because the Herald wants a sales boost.

    Fair enough, but there's a difference between taking your time and wasting time, doing nothing. Talking about changing the flag every year or two, only to abandon the conversation, then start it up again from scratch a year or two later counts as the latter as far as I can see.

    And as far as this goes:

    the current New Zealand flag is, although a bit boring, competent and dignified

    I find it very boring, messy and indstinct and I quite like the look of some of alternatives I've seen (no idea whether they originated from advertisers or elsewhere). YMMV.

    Onehunga, Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 298 posts Report Reply

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