Polity by Rob Salmond

Read Post

Polity: A short history of half-baked housing blunders

26 Responses

First ←Older Page 1 2 Newer→ Last

  • andrew001,

    House prices double in NZ under Labour, nothing to see here. House prices double, in Auckland under National, massive problem of unbelievable proportions?

    Really? Sure it's a problem, but National have done more to "try" and fix it than Labour ever did.

    Since Apr 2016 • 2 posts Report Reply

  • Ian Dalziel, in reply to andrew001,

    House prices double in NZ under Labour, nothing to see here.
    House prices double, in Auckland under National, massive problem of unbelievable proportions?

    That was then, this is now...
    you know, after 8 years of National being in power, calling the shots...

    Christchurch • Since Dec 2006 • 7886 posts Report Reply

  • andrew001, in reply to Ian Dalziel,

    "after 8 years of National being in power, calling the shots" ...

    So what? All i'm saying is that everyone blames National for house prices in Auckland rising, when in fact the seeds of this were sewn decades ago. There is no quick fix. In fact, short of massively increasing supply there is nothing much you can do until it crashes. No tax will solve it, it hasn't worked anywhere else so i doubt it will here.

    Since Apr 2016 • 2 posts Report Reply

  • Rich of Observationz,

    As I posted on another thread, when the UK government altered the tax treatment of mortgage interest in 1988, house prices went from rising rapidly to falling and dropped maybe 20%.

    If you really want to stop house prices rising, you introduce a 100% tax on the amount the sale price exceeds GV.

    Back in Wellington • Since Nov 2006 • 5550 posts Report Reply

  • Tom Johnson,

    Taxing is the most efficient means of taking immediate heat off the investment sector side of housing. Housing is a need for all citizens, not a bull market, it needs to be readdressed at its basic core, it is shelter , it is wrong to have it spiraling around like an enron share certificate.

    hamilton • Since Mar 2016 • 98 posts Report Reply

  • bob daktari, in reply to andrew001,

    rather than blaming the previous govt (the default) or passing off the problem due to you know history... this govt could have, you know, given many people a brighter future but they've consistently denied any problem existed, actively campaigned against all of labours and other parties plans to address the housing crisis (CGT, Kiwibuild) and now are only considering options they've borrowed from those other parties

    This govt can wear that blame for they have earnt it

    auckland • Since Dec 2006 • 537 posts Report Reply

  • Ian Pattison, in reply to andrew001,

    The average house price went up $200,00 in Labour’s entire 9-year term. Under National, it went up 24% in one year (2015) which eclipses all increases that occurred under Labour.

    National have done almost nothing to stop it. The SHAs have been a farce, the $50 million to secure land has disappeared with an admission they have nothing to show for it, and the suggestion that Councils re-zone land has been scotched by National’s constituency and erstwhile housing market parasites Auckland 2040. They didn't do the one thing that would actually help with this mess: rein-in housing market speculation with either a tax big enough to dissuade speculators, or simply banning people from owning more houses than they really need. Self-interest and greed. Your parents would be ashamed of you and so are your kids.

    Auckland • Since Aug 2014 • 24 posts Report Reply

  • Hilary Stace,

    Don't forget that Helensville was going to have lots of new state houses but it was in the PM's electorate so that had to go.

    Wgtn • Since Jun 2008 • 3196 posts Report Reply

  • Lindsey Rea, in reply to Hilary Stace,

    Wasn't that Hobsonville? A good mix of social housing and private housing - scotched by Key as soon at the NACTs came into office.

    Since Mar 2014 • 9 posts Report Reply

  • Jim Cathcart,

    The Home Truths series didn't address the following, which I think are crucial elements in the existence of property bubbles:

    - How banks rely on wholesale funding to fund mortgages

    - How banks are deposits are created from loans and the extent of leverage that entails

    - Since 1984, how the money supply has exploded by 6,166% and how bank lending for property has increase 23,921% (refer to this excellent article by Brian Gaynor if that seems unbelievable (http://goo.gl/XWwrlR)

    Since Nov 2006 • 228 posts Report Reply

  • Tom Johnson,

    Capitalism is about creating services that extend the pleasure of life not buying each others houses, we all have to go to sleep somewhere every 16 hours. National are a strange party, textor crosbied to cross the line every 3 years but no real capitalist vision, and that's disgraceful from the party of business, they are the tea party of N.Z

    hamilton • Since Mar 2016 • 98 posts Report Reply

  • Russell Brown, in reply to Lindsey Rea,

    Wasn’t that Hobsonville? A good mix of social housing and private housing – scotched by Key as soon at the NACTs came into office.

    Yeah, Hobsonville, The tragic irony is that Key's much-vaunted state house upbringing was in the pepper-potted suburb of Brydnwr – exactly the kind of mixed housing he scorned in Hobsonville. That's how he was able to attend Burnside High.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 22747 posts Report Reply

  • Tom Johnson, in reply to Russell Brown,

    We need a one house, one citizen city. If you have excess money you put it in the marketplace. We need to have broader domestic commerce , a broader domestic scene creates more ideas, and pure new business exists for one idea only, better ideas.

    hamilton • Since Mar 2016 • 98 posts Report Reply

  • Ian Dalziel, in reply to Russell Brown,

    leeky buildings?

    The tragic irony is that Key’s much-vaunted state house upbringing was in the pepper-potted suburb of Brydnwr

    ...that'd be Bryndwr
    I love the description of the suburb, hell city, where Key grew up:

    Bryndwr (/ˈbrɪndwər/ brind-wər; Welsh: [brənˈduːr]) is a suburb in the north-west of Christchurch, New Zealand. Like all suburbs in Christchurch, it has no defined boundaries and is a general area.

    Heck we'll even soon have two high schools that don't even exist in their own 'zones' - when Shirley Boys and Avonside Girls are shifted to the old QEII site

    Christchurch • Since Dec 2006 • 7886 posts Report Reply

  • Tom Johnson,

    A true correction will unfortunately wipe out a lot of perceived wealth but we've been there in 87, it's time to get real with our economy and not some crazy fantasy of Auckland being an international bankers town, which is John Keys fantasy. Auckland changed.

    hamilton • Since Mar 2016 • 98 posts Report Reply

  • Kurt Mastrovich, in reply to Tom Johnson,

    Nutters though the Tea Party are they at least have a vision, or visions as it were. I don't see that with National, more listless drones that occasionally discombobulate as Nick Smith has eagerly demonstrated.

    Auckland • Since Aug 2010 • 13 posts Report Reply

  • Marc C,

    From the post above:
    "It also tried to quell unease by giving certain home purchasers government grants to help buy homes. Not surprisingly, this had no helpful impact on house prices, as the extra money served to fuel demand rather than limit it."

    Hear no evil, see no evil, hear no crisis, see no crisis, that is the motto of the Key led National - ACT - UF government.

    And we now have an increasing number of people use funds from their Kiwi Saver accounts, to pay a deposit for a new home. Slowly and gradually that saving scheme, which was designed and introduced to encourage saving for your retirement, is becoming a home saver scheme, which leaves many short again in money they may save for their later years in life.

    As for the rest, Rob is right, the government has done little else than window dressing exercises when it comes to the housing (affordability) crisis in Auckland. Also it is to a fair degree a wealth shift crisis, as investors make up well over 40 percent of buyers, that is people who already own one or more homes extending their property investment portfolios. Home ownership rates are dipping, while those that already have assets in the form of homes get richer and extend their asset base.

    We will have a small class of home owners and an ever increasing number of renters, meaning more Kiwis being tenants in their own land.

    That is unless this madness is stopped, and capping immigration should also be part of measures to address all this demand, with which construction cannot keep up, as we do not even have enough builders and other tradespeople that are needed to catch up with demand.

    Laissez faire irresponsibility is what we have, criminal irresponsibility by this government. Time for Labour to get their acts together, and to manage to come across more convincingly, so people may see a true alternative to vote for. Presenting themselves as a valid alternative also means to work closely with the Greens.

    Akl • Since Oct 2012 • 437 posts Report Reply

  • Sofie Bribiesca, in reply to andrew001,

    Really? Sure it’s a problem, but National have done more to “try” and fix it than Labour ever did.

    More? Bill English, Paula Bennett, Nick Smith are the Ministers responsible for HNZ and this from the Herald pretty much sums up their expertise.

    Always with the jobs for the boys .
    They can't even address the houses already owned without ballsing it up.

    "I'm all right Jack keep your hands off of my stack" Pink Floyd comes to mind.

    here and there. • Since Nov 2007 • 6796 posts Report Reply

  • Bart Janssen, in reply to andrew001,

    the seeds of this were sewn

    This enraged me unreasonably.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 4450 posts Report Reply

  • Bart Janssen, in reply to Jim Cathcart,

    The Home Truths series didn’t address the following, which I think are crucial elements in the existence of property bubbles:

    You also forgot the effect of weekly stories in that same newspaper highlighting the enormous amounts of wealth that could be generated by investing in the Auckland housing market.

    Not criticizing that wealth gain but promoting it with all the fervor of a real estate agent whose just fallen in love with the latest model Porsche.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 4450 posts Report Reply

  • Steve Barnes, in reply to Marc C,

    we do not even have enough builders and other tradespeople that are needed to catch up with demand.

    Well, who can you blame for that? Labour?.... erm... no.
    Back when all those leaky buildings were built, National changed the rules, moved the goalposts and unleveled the playing field. By kowtowing to Australian building material manufactures, Fletcher's, Carters and a whole swag of developers, they allowed shoddy practices, untreated timber (more money for Fletcher's and Carter Holt) allowing fibre cement cladding with little or no ventilation or even insulation, narrower eaves (bigger floor area on small plots, developers rubbed their collective hands in glee). Basically allowing sub standard houses and apartments for sub prime loans for sub human conditions.
    The upshot of this is well known, they blamed the builders and now you have to jump through hoops to be able to do the job many had been doing well for years. On to of that there was the axing of many apprenticeships leading to the current shortage of construction workers. The other effect being that those developers that were building good properties became wary of building anything at all or went so far over the top in offsetting risk that the houses were too expensive for the market at the time, many went to the wall bankrupting builders and investors alike.
    I cringe when I hear people blaming "Immigrants" for this mess, the blame lies squarely with two National Governments and their supporters (those that riled against Labour's efforts to quell rising construction costs with sidetracks about light bulbs and shower heads.
    The real culprit is, of course, greed and all the legislation and regulation of a sector that has been building our homes since our ancestors landed here and the result is as obvious as the nose on the Prime Ministers face, which grows by the day.

    Peria • Since Dec 2006 • 5521 posts Report Reply

  • Rich of Observationz,

    This could be a possible solution to Auckland's housing problems:
    an airline that lets you fly as much as you want for a flat fee.

    One could even see the Uber business model being included - pilots with 100 hrs on Microsoft Flight Simulator and a few touch and goes in a Cessna could ferry passengers using modified cropdusters or ARJ-21s. None of that commercial license or airworthiness red tape!

    Back in Wellington • Since Nov 2006 • 5550 posts Report Reply

  • Kumara Republic, in reply to Steve Barnes,

    On to of that there was the axing of many apprenticeships leading to the current shortage of construction workers.

    Hell, much of the apprenticeship system itself went out the door with the passage of the old Employment Contracts Act, and NZ has been playing a game of catch-up since. On that note, for all of NZ Labour's issues, their digital apprenticeship policy is a potential deal-maker.

    And now for a quick history lesson: the Irishman who gave us the term 'boycott' was a rentier in the land & property business. If enough tenants vote with their feet, could it potentially hold a pin to the bubble, even if it means living out of suitcases or cars or tents?

    The southernmost capital … • Since Nov 2006 • 5415 posts Report Reply

  • Marc C, in reply to Steve Barnes,

    Who was "blaming" immigrants for the shortage of labour to build homes? It is bizarre how so many read stuff into words I used, which were not even meant to say what is assumed. I am astonished, indeed confused rather.

    Akl • Since Oct 2012 • 437 posts Report Reply

  • Marc C,

    The situation here in Auckland, where I live is becoming increasingly grim for renters. I have been on Trade Me and find few 2-brm units under $ 400, and a humble one near where I live now even advertised for $ 500 per week. This is for just a unit, not a house, and having searched for units, flats and so under $ 350 per week, the result is meagre, only one and a half pages of ads on offer.

    The government and Nick Smith are living in lala land when they say there is no crisis at all, as increasing numbers of people can no longer afford to live in Auckland. I read stories in the Central Leader that teachers are moving out of the city, as they cannot afford paying for housing, and so we have a shortage of teachers, early childhood teachers and even centres, with an ever increasing population here.

    It is time to vote these criminals out of office, as what they allowed to happen is criminal in my view.

    As for the polls they so often present, I do not give them much value, as I have over the last year been asked by EMR for my views, and it seems they are desperate to get people answer their endless questions that take about half an hours time to respond to. Who bothers putting up with that polling, much not even about political matters, rather on business and consumer topics. If they simply keep asking the same people again and again, and disproportionately that may be older and securely housed people with own homes, it is no wonder we get the poll results we get presented.

    It is time Labour and Greens make more efforts to attract and interest the missing million, there is no alternative to win more of them over to vote, as otherwise we may not get any change of government for some time.

    Akl • Since Oct 2012 • 437 posts Report Reply

First ←Older Page 1 2 Newer→ Last

Post your response…

Please sign in using your Public Address credentials…

Login

You may also create an account or retrieve your password.