Posts by Chris Waugh
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My apologies for jacking this thread so badly. Re: refugees, I think they should be kept separate from immigration policy and I think NZ should be doing much, much more to assist. And yes, openly not copying Australian policy.
As for immigration policy generally, I find it hard to organise my thoughts. Partly, I guess, it's being a bit too involved in things. One more piece of paperwork before we can leave, and that's a PRC document so irrelevant to the discussion at hand.... But perhaps being in the migration process puts me in a position where it's difficult to assess these things rationally. I dunno.
But I really struggle to see how capping migrant numbers would work, or adjusting the points system to maintain an effective cap. For starters, it could only apply to categories such as student, work, or business migrants. And even then, how could you reasonably tell applicants "sorry, you meet all the criteria, but we filled the quota"? To try and limit categories like refugee/asylum/protection or family reunion or spousal visas strikes me as being utterly inhumane.
And yet, of course, simply throwing open the gates and accepting all comers is not going to be a smart idea.
Still, I suspect that the real issues needing to be fixed are infrastructure, education and training, and management of the economy, and no amount of tinkering with immigration policy is going to fix those issues.
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Hard News: The Fine Line, in reply to Steve Curtis,
NZs number is around 750, which indicates they are taking 5 times the number NZ is , in proportion to population.
Which I think is something we should be looking to fix. My point with boat people vs. plane arrivals is that the prospect of masses of boats loaded with "queue jumping" refugees is held up as a kind of bogie man. "Don't vote for that other party, they'll let our shores be swamped with masses of [dog whistle] refugees!"
You are aware of course, that North Asian countries, like where you are resident have non existent refugee programs
Yes. And? To steal a line from Mr Ranapia, that's a whole 'nother kete of kaimoana, and if you want to discuss all the historical, social, ethnic/racial, national, politcal, etc, issues tied up in that, we really will need another thread, and you might have to let me go anonymous (me still being in China for the time being... ).
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Hard News: The Fine Line, in reply to Tinakori,
What if there is another?
I very much doubt there will be one, let alone another. Here's why: The standard MO seems to be to set out from Indonesia aiming for mainland Australia. So if we start there, but aim for NZ, then the boat can either sail along the north coast of Aus, through Torres Strait, thence south aiming for Northland. Either that or head south down the west side of Aus then hang a left and ride the prevailing westerlies and aim to make landfall somewhere north of Fiordland. Either way you're running the gauntlet of RAN and Aus Customs patrols, and the longer you're at sea the greater your chances of being spotted. Also, given the standard MO seems to be crowding as many refugees as you can fit onto rickety, unseaworthy boats, many of which capsize or sink between Aus and Indonesia, aiming for NZ means either investing the time and money finding and crewing a boat with a reasonable chance of arriving, which would probably set off some alarm bells in the intelligence community, or setting out to sea knowing you're almost certainly going to drown.
The other options would be to sail around the north side of Melanesia, which still adds distance and the higher chances of sinking or being seen, or westwards back across the Indian Ocean against the prevailing winds around the Cape of Good Hope and Cape Horn aiming for NZ's east coast. Why on Earth would anybody bother doing that?
So yeah, if any boat people do make it, welcome them.
Slightly more seriously: Do we really want to copy Aus's policies and lock them up in camps? With all the breaches of international law and human rights abuses that have been documented? No, thanks.
Besides, don't Australia's own stats show that most "queue-jumping" refugees arrive by plane rather than boat? Doesn't that show up all this "OMG! The boat people are coming!" nonsense for what it really is?
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Hard News: The Fine Line, in reply to Moz,
I’d also like to see the refugee intake kept up and out of this discussion (yes, I’m the first to mention it). Especially it could and should be used as a stick to beat Australia with rather than becoming yet another symptom of our sycophancy.
Absolutely. And I'm of the view that if we do somehow get a load of boat people washing up at Raglan or wherever, we should welcome them with open arms. If they've got the gumption to take on that huge a risk and succeed, then they're the kind of entrepreneurial spirits we need, right?
It's odd, I find myself agreeing with the Nats, and it feels weird, but there does seem to be a lot that is beyond the control of any government. You can't just stop your own citizens coming back or round up unemployed youth and force them onto planes to Australia. I can't help but thinking a little more investment in educating and training our own youth might help cut down the need to import skilled labour, though.
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Capture: Lost, in reply to Angus McNaughton,
Great shot, Angus. And welcome.
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There once was a market here, and a yard where Beijing Jeep stored its new cars...
On the way to...
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Capture: Lost, in reply to Sofie Bribiesca,
Your pics are nice, too. Especially the last one: "Before I die..." Intriguing.
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Capture: Lost, in reply to Nora Leggs,
layered.
Indeed.
And the mall doesn't really look this sombre, but somehow I think my phone caught the feel of this space better than my eyes. (and ice skating? In summer?)
And not just lost, but transported back to a time when toddlers rode triceratopses.
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It's hard to not be constantly lost in this city.
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Too late to edit, but I think I prefer that in B&W.
And shot through a filthy window...
