Cracker: Strike Nine (and counting)
249 Responses
First ←Older Page 1 … 5 6 7 8 9 10 Newer→ Last
-
A couple of, ahem, "humourous" comments on Garrett I've seen on Arsebook:
"If I bore the mark of an ACT MP, I'd want a new identity as well"
and
"David Garrett committed identity fraud after reading Day Of The Jackal. Just be thankful he didn't read American Psycho."
-
it was generally implied (in the media, etc) that Worth's comments were of an inappropriate sexual nature and there's been little dispute about that being the case
The whole idea of carefully refusing to say why is that it creates an information vacuum. I wouldn't go assuming we know what happened. You could say it seems likely to be about more than 'comments' given some of the other behaviour that has been tolerated since. Anything but "simple".
-
Friday brain teaser:
Yeah hypocrisy twists my brain in knots too. I've been more thinking "Is it hypocritical of me to think it's all good that Garrett's name suppression was pushed aside, when one of the things I least like about him is that he thinks that's a good idea for other people?". The problem is that enjoying seeing someone getting nailed for being a hypocrite is always going to be hypocritical in this kind of way.
I've only got two responses so far, but others can help out here:
1. Yeah, I'm a hypocrite, but at least I'm not holding public office.
2. Actually, I don't like it. But that doesn't mean he's not a hypocrite.I think part of the problem is that basing an argument around the other person being a hypocrite is always going to be a tu quoque fallacy. Garrett can still, in all consistency, say "Yes, I was a hypocrite, but I got busted, and that's actually good in the end, and I still believe that people with name suppression should be outed". In fact, he, and others from SST will now have even more of a case, because they can say "well we got outed, and it was in the public good, wasn't it?".
This outcome works in their favor in a perverse way. It actually highlights that name suppression can be quite a broken law, and in this case ended up victimizing the family who could say nothing about the hypocrite who stole their baby's identity, then hid behind a name suppression whilst campaigning against it.
But in the end, I don't think my concerns are going to bother too many other people.
-
Small world......Hilary Calvert's husband is a second cousin of my wife......
-
I guess the real solution to my conundrum is that my reasons for disliking Garrett's position aren't based on him being a hypocrite, they have other reasons altogether, which don't fall under the tu quoque blanket. The reason is because we trust judges to decide whether the destruction of the career of a public figure is punishment proportional to the crime. The fact that this judge didn't have all of the facts because Garrett failed to disclose his more recent crime, is something that simply highlights that the law is not guaranteed to work correctly. But it's still the best system we have.
In which case, I think I can rest easy with myself in enjoying seeing a hypocrite (and also a fairly nasty person) outed, and a party I really don't like in turmoil and disgrace, undermining the support they can provide to a government I didn't vote for, don't trust, and am now actually afraid of.
-
Thank you Ben Wilson - you have summed up my responses in your last paragraph exactly.
-
Having respect for someone is not the same as saying they're better than me.
I think a lot of people start with a position of disrespect towards MPs, and I don't think that's healthy. Skepticism perhaps.
Quite agree, and I/S shits me sometimes with that stuff.
Distrusting or demeaning someone solely on the basis that they have presented themselves for consideration as a democratic representative doesn't make sense to me.
I was trying to say this yesterday.
-
From Stuff:
Prime Minister John Key has sent a message to disgraced former ACT MP David Garrett that he needs to think "seriously" about his future as an MP.
Key said given the New Zealand public's reaction to Garrett's faked passport scam he should go away for the next two weeks and "think very seriously about his future with the Government"
Why not send the same message to Rodney?
-
In which case, I think I can rest easy with myself in enjoying seeing a hypocrite (and also a fairly nasty person) outed, and a party I really don't like in turmoil and disgrace, undermining the support they can provide to a government I didn't vote for, don't trust, and am now actually afraid of.
Rest easy Ben. The problem I have had all along is the mightier than thou attitude that Jackal and Hide have.They stood for the SST platform which gave them a very narrow margin with which to represent their supporters.Their abuse of that very platform whilst including the spokesperson for the SST through Garrett court case references just confirms to me that a lobby group should not be in Parliament. Surely this is the Final Act. Plus Hide has never been inclusive. Try and hijack our city. It's all good riddance to bad garbage in my book and I'm gonna rest easy. :)
-
Be it so Sofie!
-
It's hard maintaining a position of good faith with politicians when their occupation rates so low in public trust polls for a reason.
However I believe most have the best of motivations even if their methods aren't always admirable. It's too tough a job to attract the moderately committed (though that level of passion is also part of the problem).
Yet I feel perfectly comfortable saying that Garrett, Hide and their enablers are worthy neither of our trust nor the privilege of office. Those who voted for them deserve better representation.
-
Of course Hide is on Campbell live, hanging on for dear life hoping to save his arse. How narcissistic can ya get. "I didn't know much,I trusted the judge, me, I am the hardest working MP.I have done wonderful things. I love John Key, vote for me"
Whatever! -
In which John Key has responded " We love Rodney," for all the parrots out there.
-
True, but it was generally implied (in the media, etc) that Worth's comments were of an inappropriate sexual nature and there's been little dispute about that being the case.
Okay, to clarify: I understand that (or, more correctly, that this is the current speculation because, as Sacha said, no-one actually knows.) I was bemused by your "not his wife" addition - because his marital status was really, really not the focus of the coverage, and you made the whole thing sound, to me, like he resigned because he was caught cheating rather than, as is (speculatively!) the case, because he was "sexually inappropriate" towards someone.
-
Kyle, as I said (and you ignored), the news is *all* about the dead child's ID. That's why Garrett has been dumped. Public opinion.
The claim was made that Hide knew that Garrett lied to the court. We don't know that at all.
Even if Hide demanded all the court documents relating to the 2005 case, that wouldn't have helped him. TVNZ have been saying that the document that they've seen isn't in the court documents, they've gotten it from elsewhere (I haven't heard anywhere where).
So it's entirely possible that ACT investigated his 2005 court appearance, heard about his 2002 conviction in Tonga, and didn't know that he'd lied to the court in 2005.
-
In which John Key has responded " We love Rodney," for all the parrots out there.
*sigh* That's a little OTT, Sofie. If anything, Key is perfectly sensibly no more throwing himself into the internal ructions of another party than Helen did when the Alliance was melting down.
-
In other news, is PSA secretary Brenda Pilott sure she wants to be wearing Garth and Greg's manky mantle?
22 year-old Latu Kepu got six-years and four months for the manslaughter of Jason Palmer, at Springhill prison in May.
PSA National Secretary Brenda Pilott said it certainly won't make prison workers feel their jobs are valued, "members in the prison are distressed and surprised" and feel "it's a pretty derisory sentence in exchange for a life... the risks they face everyday aren't acknowledged."
Oh fuck off, Brenda...
-
Distrusting or demeaning someone solely on the basis that they have presented themselves for consideration as a democratic representative doesn't make sense to me.
Not saying that at all. It just seems to me the whole "democratic" process has developed fatal flaws along the way. It is no longer representative. A class of people has sprung up that seem to exist in and around parliament. I dont know if it is to the exclusion of all else that happens on this planet involving people.
But very often other peoples lives are reduced to virtually prejudicial, one dimensional, fit only to be judged as of less "value" than them.
All we get reflected back at us is a view of life that is useless to a changing reality.
Celebrate sports matches... can I afford food this week.
Politicians head in the trough, but cutting social services.
Its the have's telling the have not's what to do.
And those who have lived a life not concerned with image/preserving the appearance that they are like everyone else and non threatening, safe to be elected, no skeletons in the closet. OK me.
There is no way I could ever consider such a move. Yet I would have more to contribute that 90% of any politician in power.
But you'll never find out willya. -
*sigh* That's a little OTT, Sofie. If anything, Key is perfectly sensibly no more throwing himself into the internal ructions of another party than Helen did when the Alliance was melting down.
Fair enough, and incidently I expected a sigh and response from you Craig(didn't expect RB in one of my dreams though, it was to do with Rugby all right?) Craig, is there a short hand for rolls eyes or is the sigh the closest? I maybe should have noted that It seemed to be a natural progression from the Harald. It seemed as though it had gone into damage control to save the right.That was my slightly obscure "parrots" reference.Just, I expected it. I also don't think Alliance split and consequent renaming and shrinking is a great comparison in this incident. That perhaps could be used in the Roy split of allegiance
:) -
Celebrate sports matches... can I afford food this week.
Politicians head in the trough, but cutting social services.
Its the have's telling the have not's what to do.Yeah Term of endurance. I dreaded it's return and here we are.
-
ACT is a mad dog's breakfast. It'd be interesting to poll Epsom at the electorate level and find out what they really think of their erstwhile elected representative. I'm surprised TVNZ and TV3 haven't decided on that course of action...
Craig Y
-
I'm surprised TVNZ and TV3 haven't decided on that course of action...
TV3 are checking in on the Epsom voter. They are not happy and will not vote Act but the New Market Business Assoc. like Rodney.
-
What next, are we to learn that John Boscawen never was interested in lightly smacking children's bottoms; that its all been bravado, in-order to look sensible?
I'm pretty sure that's the case.
I may be confusing him with Roger Douglas, but at least one, if not both never smacked their kids and think there are better ways, just don't think parents who choose to smack should be considered criminals.
-
3410,
but the New Market Business Assoc. like Rodney
That was strange, wasn't it?; " We still back Rodney".
What, all of you?
-
That was strange, wasn't it?; " We still back Rodney".
What, all of you?
I didn't see Cameron Brewer anywhere. Oh that's right, he has pissed people off with his own campaign for Orakei.
It 'seams', it's all falling apart ;-)
Post your response…
This topic is closed.