Field Theory: Send in the clowns
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By the way, considering the other threads that are going, feel free to bitch anything on TV (or anywhere else) that just isn't funny.
OK then; that Te Radar country programme on at the moment.
And before you jump to conclusions HG, it’s not because he’s a ginga.
I just don’t understand the point of it, and don’t find any of it remotely funny.
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The appeal of Seinfeld has managed to completely bypass me too. It's just not that great, folks.
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Well, I never liked Seinfeld, the character. He was just an unfunny cipher with terrible dress sense. That show was really all about the wonderment that was George. (And some Elaine. With tiny doses of Kramer.)
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By the way, considering the other threads that are going, feel free to bitch anything on TV (or anywhere else) that just isn't funny.
The News. both channels. Lazy attempts to satirise actual news bulletins that just don't come off cos they're trying to hard to be ironic. or something.
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That show was really all about the wonderment that was George.
Specifically George's parents. Frank Costanza = greatest character on a sitcom ever...
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Oh, and anything involving Jamie Oliver.
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I never liked Seinfeld. Does that mean I have no soul?
I don't want to get all meta-physical but ... yes. Sorry.
'The Millen Baird Show': local comedy that had a short run on TV3 the other month along with pan-asian sketch show 'A Thousand Apologies'
A friend saw them and warned me off them, I feel very lucky. But I also never, ever, liked Bro Town.
So far it's not good run for the local comedies
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Haydn, are you forgetting a certain __Melody Rules__?
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I'll tell ya what's funny... a researcher named Finding.
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but the jokes were funny even if you didn't know what "Jewish" was
I imagine someone watching, laughing, and remarking, "Heh, I don't know what a "Jew" is, but they sure are funny!"
Re Ting Ting on Little Britain. That was my 'jump the shark' moment. The first time I saw it I sighed a little bit and didn't laugh. It wasn't funny; it was just a lame racial stereotype that seemed to have been brought back from a death in the 1970s. (Comedy zombie?)
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Pretty sure he butt of the Ting Ting joke is not Ting Ting, but the prick that got her to Britain in the first place.
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I'll tell ya what's funny... a researcher named Finding
I laughed at that too.
"Finding's findings were that..." -
I never liked Seinfeld. Does that mean I have no soul?
Nope -- then again, I seem to be the only person on Earth who finds Fawlty Towers and The Office (original recipie) almost unwatchably sad. Not that they're bad shows, but really find Basil Fawlty's manic outbursts bring back too many memories that aren't fun at all. And David Brent? Painful - and it just doesn't stop.
And completely off topic but (Semi)-bitch-worthy: David Tennant will be leaving Doctor Who. Bugger.
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And David Brent? Painful - and it just doesn't stop.
I remember watching the second season of The Office and thinking how I couldn't watch this guy continue to get himself into those situations. Which is why I really liked the Christmas special.
re: Tennant.
I heard about it yesterday, but I imagine it'll really sink in once I get to watching the new series on DVD -
This paper offers a [doctrinal] critique of the UK comedy sketch show Little Britain. [...] The paper concludes that, although there are parts of Little Britain in which stereotypes are challenged, and the abusive power dynamic is inverted through humour, for the most part, Little Britain colludes with prejudice by positing an 'us' - the audience, who callously mocks 'them' - figures representative of marginalised groups already vulnerable to harm.
Hypothesis:
Finding's concludes through doctrinal reasoning that if I - an audience member - find the mocking in Little Britian funny I am a prejudiced victimiser of marginalised groups.Observation:
I know I am not a prejudiced victimiser of marginalised groups and yet I have found Little Britain funny*. Also Finding's can write with coherence and does draw logical conclusions within the doctrinal constraints.Conclusion:
Feminism (the doctinal reasoning used) is EPIC FAIL.* - funny the 1st, but tedious the 7th or 8th time the same joke ran.
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The problem as fas as I can tell is not the Anguses of this world who are smart enough to see the stereotyping as excessive parody of stereotyping itself. Rather it's the surprisingly large number of people who will reflexively lol at the stereotypes just because of what they are, and only self-justify it as 'poking fun at racism' later (if at all).
As Dave Chappelle found with his 'racial pixies' sketch, ironic racism tends to attract followers of genuine racism even when you do it with the best of intentions. Not an easy thing for comedians to work around.
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Seeing as I brought it up I'll just say I though A Thousand Apologies wasn't that bad. Partly because one or two really funny bits in an episode bought a lot of forgiveness from me.
That said, I did a certain amount of re-working of their material in my head, which is never a good sign.
It was also fairly clearly not just about but aimed at those asian diasporia types, which I am not one. Though the Embedded Asian Underground did do a lot of prep work on me.
Millen Baird OTOH - there were some signs of episode-long building plotlines that would pay off at the end. But mostly I got the impression of not-especially-ironic dressups, so I never stayed to see.
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The problem as fas as I can tell is not the Anguses of this world who are smart enough to see the stereotyping as excessive parody of stereotyping itself. Rather it's the surprisingly large number of people who will reflexively lol at the stereotypes just because of what they are, and only self-justify it as 'poking fun at racism' later (if at all).
Many people do find overblown parodies of stereotypical life funny, because that shit is instinctively funny and is therefore not strange behaviour at all. The characters are overblown parodies created for the point of entertainment, when people laugh they have no need to justify the lol because they are laughing at the parody.
OTOH very few pople are racists, because racist doctrine is stupid. However racists have a similar sense of humour to the rest of us and so will find parodies funny.
A doctrine that cooks up the conclusion of laughing at a parody of a subject denigrated by racism proves you are a racist is silly, because it is well known fact that people find humour humourous. Finding uses feminist doctrine, Finding's feminism is silly.
If for instance there was a doctrine that considered petunias to be the paragon of all virtue, my laughing at "On no, not again" in hitchhikers guide to the galaxy would not reveal any inherent anti-petuninista tendencies. Nor for that matter would my finding the joke completely unfunny* rule out the possibility that I did in fact hate petunias.
* not that I could, that shit is the shit.
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Hmm. Looking back, Gareth Ward put my point a lot more clearly:
perhaps the fair criticism would be to state that not everyone quite gets that so certain people (already inclined that way I'd imagine) see the joke in the stereotype, rather than in the lampooning of the stereotype.
I would love to be proven conclusively wrong on this, but sadly I think there are a lot of people who don't necessarily follow "racist doctrine" but who still carry around patronising, ignorant attitudes towards people different from themselves - particularly when they believe that they are modern inclusive people, and thus don't understand why anyone has the right to criticise their attitudes.
So it's not that enjoying Little Britain makes you an [x]-ist - a point which I don't think Finding actually put forward - but that when you put exaggerated stereotypes in front of a general population, you will get many people who see the exaggeration and laugh, and many other people who see the stereotype, and are likely relieved to be able to laugh at it publicly. It sucks that thoughtful comedians have to deal with this stuff when considering how to make a joke, but sadly we live in a world where biases attach to people, not petunias.
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For comparison: The Merchant of Venice.
Now, Shakespeare is typically so full of life that it's possible to forge an understanding of the play to suit your opinions about humanity (mine, anyway). But it's even more difficult to make a (non-rewritten) unracist Merchant than a feminist Taming of the Shrew.
And even if you manage to make a performance that deals with the way pretty much all of the lead characters are bigots, some people will still have their prejudices confirmed.
I think the conter-argument is probably that people will have the prejudices confirmed by everything that happens to them, so there's no point trying to account for it. But I imagine that doesn't always wash.
(Incidentally, there's an fascinating rewrite by Arnold Wesker called The Merchant (this essay includes summary info), written basically as an answer to the racism of the original)
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Having now read a large portion of Findings paper I'm afraid to say its presumptuous rubbish. The paper should as has rightly been argued here been about multiple perspectives on the same joke and the social/entertainment worth of these perspectives. What we end up with is a weak historical "these jokes were funny but these jokes aren't argument". I was particularly disappointed by the dull witted post-feminist swipe in the Vicky Pollard analysis where it is was pointed out -
" It is interesting to see that in the transition from Wayne and Waynetta Slob and Paul and Pauline Calf to Vicky Pollard, that the male figure has been removed."
Finding offers no further interpretation and begs for the usual conspiracy dog whistle as a result.
Lazy thinking by, a lazy intellect provides food for lazy media. Which in turn precipatates predictable un-funny results.
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Jeez I'm impressed by how much thought some of youse has put into this... I was just talking to myself before (as you do) and we all reckoned that everybody's racist really, it's merely a matter of over-riding those dull reptilian urges and realising everybody's people too, being a better perp and not a dick.
If you can't laugh at concentration camps/slavery/*add your own terrible thing you shouldn't laugh at here*, what CAN you laugh at?
Surely humour is meant to be awful, in the glad-that's-not-happening-to-me way of things... remember, tragedy is only half the wheel, comedy is tragedy averted or overcome and we all get to laugh.
But there's still no excuse for David Brent. That guy's just painful. Brilliant of course. But if I need to be uncomfortable, I'll go to a political rally, or a knitting circle, or a dDub gig or something.
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