Hard News by Russell Brown

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Hard News: A week being a long time in politics

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  • merc,

    Hatip No Right Turn, http://norightturn.blogspot.com/2011/11/this-is-why-we-have-oia.html
    Why would Key block the OIA request? If what I suspect is going on, this could be very, very damning.
    Later, oh I see he is blocking it because it would affect the money he gets for selling if he was to tell us why he is actually selling, hmmmmm the Trader in him. I say any deal that you cannot talk about is a private conversation, oh that's right, he is Prime Minister.
    This smells real bad.

    Since Dec 2006 • 2471 posts Report Reply

  • Kumara Republic, in reply to merc,

    Why would Key block the OIA request? If what I suspect is going on, this could be very, very damning.

    "Commercial sensitivity. We could tell you, but then we'd have to kill you."

    The southernmost capital … • Since Nov 2006 • 5419 posts Report Reply

  • Bart Janssen, in reply to hamishm,

    limit overseas shareholders to 10%

    No they will limit individual shareholder to 10%.

    The logic being that each 9.99% shareholder will be independent of the other shareholders

    as opposed to being dummy companies with shared directors and the same financial backing

    no that would never happen ...

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 4451 posts Report Reply

  • merc, in reply to Kumara Republic,

    I wish it was that ;-) His not telling is not legal (I wish), is undemocratic (remember us John!) and his not taking Treasury advice, and taking private oral advice (I can smell the agenda on his breath), either the work of a fool or a charlatan...or both.

    Asset sales information held back

    A significant amount of information is being held back from the public about this asset sales programme. In fact five official reports on asset sales policy are being kept secret.
    The Ombudsman has made an official ruling that the Government was right to refuse the release of these papers.
    The ruling says it is too early in the sales process, and if the information got out now it could affect the amount of money gained from these assets.
    The ruling also says the negative economic impact of that could be significant given the total asset sales price is expected to be between $5 billion and $7 billion.
    ONE News has argued that people need this information to judge whether the asset sales policy stacks up, given they are about to go to the polls in a few days' time.
    The Ombudsman will hear ONE News' final case tomorrow and make a final ruling probably by Thursday. That would leave one day for this to be debated before people go to the polls to vote on Saturday.
    http://tvnz.co.nz/election-2011/ombudsman-called-in-over-asset-sales-secrets-4559548
    This is not the work of an honest plan, why the rush?

    Since Dec 2006 • 2471 posts Report Reply

  • BenWilson,

    The plaintiffs application, for a declaration of the discussion between the Prime Minister, the Hon, John Key, and the ACT Party candidate for Epsom, John Banks, at the Urban Cafe on the 11th November 2011 was not a "private conversation" as defined in S216A of the Crimes Act 1961, is declined

    Parse that and stay fashionable.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 10633 posts Report Reply

  • Sacha, in reply to merc,

    The existence of considerable prep work for asset sales has not been a secret from the opposition. Nor the media. Just the public.

    Ak • Since May 2008 • 19686 posts Report Reply

  • Sacha, in reply to merc,

    if the information got out now it could affect the amount of money gained from these assets.

    Fair argument. Shame TVNZ waited so long before doing any story at all.

    Ak • Since May 2008 • 19686 posts Report Reply

  • merc, in reply to Sacha,

    We have been well served ;-) Oh and I don't think it is a fair argument at all, the right that we the voters need to know why the sales must be enacted in order to make an informed vote, overrides the outcome of said sales, in my view. Because, since when in NZ legislation does it say the market must rule?

    Since Dec 2006 • 2471 posts Report Reply

  • Rich Lock, in reply to BenWilson,

    Parse that and stay fashionable.

    From the Stuff article:

    Chief High Court judge Justice Helen Winkelmann delivered her decision today saying she declined to make the declaration as it would amount to a "mini-trial" in advance of a police investigation into the matter.

    The application has been declined, but that doesn't actually amount to a decalaration that says that the conversation was private.

    What it effectively means is that any sort of resolution won't happen before Saturday.

    back in the mother countr… • Since Feb 2007 • 2728 posts Report Reply

  • Sacha, in reply to merc,

    the voters need to know why the sales must be enacted in order to make an informed vote

    I agree, but those reports were likely to contain commercial detail, not overall policy 'reasoning'.

    Ak • Since May 2008 • 19686 posts Report Reply

  • BenWilson, in reply to Rich Lock,

    What it effectively means is that any sort of resolution won't happen before Saturday.

    Unless the quantum superposition of the privacy of the conversation collapses by someone just hardening up and posting it in its naked glory.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 10633 posts Report Reply

  • Sacha, in reply to Rich Lock,

    What it effectively means is that any sort of resolution won't happen before Saturday

    mission achieved

    Ak • Since May 2008 • 19686 posts Report Reply

  • hamishm,

    If it was an honest attempt by Key et al we should have been kept up to date all the way through. Most people would accept that there would be some details that couldn't be made public but if this really is the pot of gold that we are being told that it is then I think we are owed the courtesy of being informed.
    I hope that the real government of NZ is being consulted. Will no one think of Warner Brothers!?!?!?

    Since Nov 2006 • 357 posts Report Reply

  • Terry Baucher, in reply to BenWilson,

    Unless the quantum superposition of the privacy of the conversation collapses by someone just hardening up and posting it in its naked glory.

    THis is the bit that gets me: it's a scoop in the truest sense of the term yet the HoS asks permission? Whatever happened to "publish and be damned"? Can you imagine the British or Aussie press being so pusillanimous in a similar situation? It's a political meeting held in full view to decide who gets to control $75 billion a year in spending and that's private? WOnder who it was who didn't include a "public interest" defence?

    Devonport • Since Nov 2008 • 91 posts Report Reply

  • Sacha, in reply to hamishm,

    the Australian finance industry has already had its palm crossed with gold

    Ak • Since May 2008 • 19686 posts Report Reply

  • Rich Lock, in reply to BenWilson,

    Unless the quantum superposition of the privacy of the conversation collapses by someone just hardening up and posting it in its naked glory.

    Unless one or more of the mainstream media outlets grow a pair and do exactly that, I doubt it'll make a difference.

    I'd guess not all that high a percentage of the population would actively seek out a recording or transcript hosted offshore, but it's hard to avoid if it's leading the 6.00 news or printed on the front page.

    back in the mother countr… • Since Feb 2007 • 2728 posts Report Reply

  • Craig Ranapia, in reply to Terry Baucher,

    Whatever happened to “publish and be damned”?

    I've got a suggestion - the next time you want to be brave with other people's reputations and livelihoods put your money where your mouth is. And, quite frankly, do think "publish and damn the consequences" is a big part of what's wrong with tabloid media culture in the UK?

    North Shore, Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 12370 posts Report Reply

  • Terry Baucher,

    I'd guess not all that high a percentage of the population would actively seek out a recording or transcript hosted offshore

    Interesting point, especially when you consider TV3's link to Fairfax and that the HoS has overseas owners. I would have though it would be a simple matter for the transcript to "accidentally" appear overseas.

    The other point that comes to mind is when are the Police going to execute their search warrants? Or is that also something that will be resolved after the weekend?

    The cynic in me says that no-one in the media wants to press the matter either because they're owned by the Govt (RNZ and TVNZ) or have been bailed out by the Govt (Mediaworks) or just don't want to get offside (HoS). Dispiriting, really particularly as I'm pretty certain what's on the tapes is mostly petty gossip.

    Devonport • Since Nov 2008 • 91 posts Report Reply

  • Terry Baucher, in reply to Craig Ranapia,

    OK Craig, just how do I publish and be damned when I don't have the tape or the transcripts?

    Devonport • Since Nov 2008 • 91 posts Report Reply

  • Terry Baucher,

    And, quite frankly, do think “publish and damn the consequences” is a big part of what’s wrong with tabloid media culture in the UK?

    The key word there is "tabloid" and I'd agree with you that there's a problem in the UK but that's not the issue at hand here. You'll also recall that the lawyer for Milly Dowler's family thought any comparison was wrong.

    Devonport • Since Nov 2008 • 91 posts Report Reply

  • Terry Baucher,

    The other point that comes to mind is when are the Police going to execute their search warrants? Or is that also something that will be resolved after the weekend?

    I stand corrected. Good. http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10768152

    Devonport • Since Nov 2008 • 91 posts Report Reply

  • Ian Dalziel,

    The logic being that each 9.99% shareholder will
    be independent of the other shareholders

    Oh! So Mom could own 9.9% but Pop would
    only be allowed to own .1%, unless they split up
    of course...

    Christchurch • Since Dec 2006 • 7889 posts Report Reply

  • Rob S, in reply to Craig Ranapia,

    Trivialising what news is by turning papers into entertainment and gossip is the main driver of the low end papers problems in the UK.
    Withholding some genuine public interest information is only an embarassment to the Governing classes. In my opinion the insight and importance of the 'tea tapes' or whatever the crap they're known as falls firmly into the publish and be damned folder.
    God alone knows our papers are turning into gossip rags enough already but not having the intestinal fortitude to break and or investigate important stories is not helpful to us as a society.
    If the same scenario had occurred in regard of Phil Goff or any other party leader I don't imagine the line taken by National would include anything in regard of protecting the public from having their private suicide conversations being exposed.
    Yes there has been a lot of flatulance and humbug from all sides in regard of this, but its value as an insight into our leaders thinking and mores has been suppressed.
    I know your opinion on this differs to mine Craig but I'm sure we can both cope with that.

    Since Apr 2010 • 136 posts Report Reply

  • BenWilson, in reply to Rich Lock,

    I'd guess not all that high a percentage of the population would actively seek out a recording or transcript hosted offshore, but it's hard to avoid if it's leading the 6.00 news or printed on the front page.

    Yup, it's down to the big boyz or it won't happen. Which means it won't happen. Which means in retrospect, the strategy of aggressively hiding something that is hardly even news has paid off dividends for National, mostly because no voters are swayed by the tea scandal, and nothing else was being covered in great depth. It checked the steep decline their polling was indicating.

    It's not over yet, though. Undecideds can swing the government either way. Two days could also be a long time in politics.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 10633 posts Report Reply

  • Bart Janssen, in reply to BenWilson,

    by someone just hardening up and posting it

    That would be an editor with a spine would it?

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 4451 posts Report Reply

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