Hard News by Russell Brown

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Hard News: Doing over the witness

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  • Joe Wylie, in reply to Dylan Reeve,

    The thing is – we have no context at all for how usual or unusual this is. We don’t know what items the police believed they were looking for, what processes were used during that search, whether all officers were involved for the whole time, what downtime there was.

    Your constant harping on 'we' ignores that you could well be addressing people who, for all you know, may well be better informed about a number of aspects of this case and its background than you are. Yet you continue to offer yourself as some kind of paragon of virtuous ignorance.

    flat earth • Since Jan 2007 • 4591 posts Report Reply

  • Dylan Reeve, in reply to Trevor Nicholls,

    The thing about “normal” is that a reasonably large number of people are familiar with it. As things stand, this appears pretty extreme, if not a first of its kind. Perhaps it really is “the new normal”, in which case we should be starting to think about a revolution, not downplaying it.

    I've not really seen anything like that, but if you'd like to point be at some information I'm keen to look at it. Everything I've seen is really just speculation.

    Auckland • Since Aug 2008 • 311 posts Report Reply

  • Rex Widerstrom, in reply to Terry Baucher,

    Seriously though the police [are] too willing to be biddable.

    FIFY.

    Not getting at you personally Terry, but I've had things said and done to me that leave me without a shadow of a doubt that the Police are entirely biddable by their political masters, and that a damaging and quite improper level of "we'll turn a blind eye if you do" goes on.

    It's all about, for the Police, more resources and more freedom (always at our expense) through increased statutory power and little or no proper oversight. When was the last time a Commissioner said "we've quite enough power under XY Act to deal with this, we don't need any more thanks"? Yet this is usually the case, even with terror-related activity.

    In return, Police enforce ridiculous laws without complaint (e.g. marijuana cultivation and possession) but which allow politicians to proselytise about being "tough on crime and the causes of crime", and those which they know to be ineffective but which add to the government's coffers (e.g. speed cameras). And most importantly, of course, find it's almost never "in the public interest" to prosecute wrongdoing by politicians unless, like Philip Field, they're too much of an embarrassment and a sacrificial scalp is needed.

    Perth, Western Australia • Since Nov 2006 • 157 posts Report Reply

  • Dylan Reeve, in reply to Joe Wylie,

    Your constant harping on ‘we’ ignores that you could well be addressing people who, for all you know, may well be better informed about a number of aspects of this case and its background than you are. Yet you continue to offer yourself as some kind of paragon of virtuous ignorance.

    Aside from the police I'm not really aware of anyone who is better informed about it - I've certainly not seen anyone claim to be. However I'm entirely willing to have my ignorance dispelled, at which point I'm happy to reconsider my position.

    Auckland • Since Aug 2008 • 311 posts Report Reply

  • Dylan Reeve, in reply to Kumara Republic,

    In any case, there are times when the law has to be bent for the greater good. Especially when those entrusted to maintain the law think it’s not illegal when the President’s doing it.

    In general I'd rather have that law bending take place in a court, not at the whim of police.

    If the police are found to be wrong in this instance in a court then it can inform future behavior in a predictable and accountable way.

    Auckland • Since Aug 2008 • 311 posts Report Reply

  • Jack Harrison, in reply to Kumara Republic,

    Yes, information. Say I supply information on Deep Red and use it strategically to screw him publicly (slander). Deep Red may suddenly wonder, “How the fuck did he know that”?

    So information was supplied to Deep Red that I was being fed his information by the government. Deep Red is upset and understandably angry. Information on these kind of carry-ons were never going to come up naturally. Deep Red publishes. He is now the criminal.

    wellington • Since Aug 2014 • 296 posts Report Reply

  • Bart Janssen, in reply to John Morrison,

    Are the newspapers, tv and radio really going to turn a blind eye to this?

    As I've commented before this is a pretty good litmus test for those 4th estate entities that see themselves as genuine news organisations or are happy to be in the pay of the National Party/WO smear machine.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 4451 posts Report Reply

  • Bart Janssen, in reply to Joe Wylie,

    over your head there

    Above sand level then ...

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 4451 posts Report Reply

  • mark taslov, in reply to Dylan Reeve,

    Fixed that for ya:

    I’m trying to look at the most basic facts while ignoring the context.

    Te Ika-a-Māui • Since Mar 2008 • 2281 posts Report Reply

  • Russell Brown, in reply to Dylan Reeve,

    …although I think the stolen hard drive that Slater received would be. Although I don’t think it was proven that it was stolen.

    No, not proven. But Justice Asher ventured that that seemed to be the case in his decision.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 22756 posts Report Reply

  • Jack Harrison, in reply to Bart Janssen,

    You know what dirty means in the title. The way that everyone is expendable for their political motives. It’s their words, unguarded, natural but dirty as a mafia sting or a shakespeare play. Hager didn’t write a book, he tried to make sense of a string of a dirtily worded correspondence between people who rule us and a Blog/p.r site run by John Slaters son

    wellington • Since Aug 2014 • 296 posts Report Reply

  • Ian Dalziel, in reply to Marc C,

    Now we have the NZ government about to announce that they will send soldiers to Iraq, to support allies in the fight against IS.

    So wrong...

    NZ needs to be the voice of reason
    and the face of acceptance,
    the arms of support,
    not just another
    combatant.

    Isn't that what we'd want to bring
    to the UN Security Council table?

    Otherwise, just what is our point of difference?

    Christchurch • Since Dec 2006 • 7892 posts Report Reply

  • Sacha,

    Rawshark said on Twitter the relevant penalty was 7 years jail.

    Ak • Since May 2008 • 19688 posts Report Reply

  • Sofie Bribiesca, in reply to Jack Harrison,

    We live in hope Jack. Still, once law is changed, we then need to repeal . That takes a lot of time assuming all Parties will want that.

    here and there. • Since Nov 2007 • 6796 posts Report Reply

  • Jack Harrison, in reply to Sofie Bribiesca,

    I just want everyone to re-read the book. There's headline after headline in there.

    It's a dump.

    wellington • Since Aug 2014 • 296 posts Report Reply

  • mark taslov, in reply to Steve Bell,

    If Hager had been around when the search warrant had been executed, the police would have been able to demand from him the access keys to the cloud storage where he would have put anything he really didn’t want them to find. But they raided him when he was absent and forewent any such opportunity.

    Out of interest, what would be the penalty for refusing such a demand?

    Te Ika-a-Māui • Since Mar 2008 • 2281 posts Report Reply

  • Sacha,

    the journalist is Slater

    not buying it

    Ak • Since May 2008 • 19688 posts Report Reply

  • Sofie Bribiesca, in reply to Jack Harrison,

    Yes ,I'd like it compulsory reading in high school along with Hollow Men.People seem pretty complacent. It is also proving to be the only way to show Team Key for who they are and their complicit behaviour. Sadly I've never liked or trusted them and if history is indeed showing similarity to what we are seeing here, you can bet ya there is similarity to where we are heading right now.

    here and there. • Since Nov 2007 • 6796 posts Report Reply

  • Keir Leslie,

    it’s unreasonable to assume the worst.

    Why is it unreasonable to assume the worst? These are literally the people that brought us the Red Devils case, the various botched murder investigations over the past 25 years, the Urewera Raids, the Kim Dotcom raid, breaking kids' faces at parties, etc. etc. I don't trust the cops, and I don't expect anyone else to.

    Since Jul 2008 • 1452 posts Report Reply

  • izogi, in reply to Sofie Bribiesca,

    I’d like it compulsory reading in high school along with Hollow Men.People seem pretty complacent.

    That'll be a tough one to get past some of the parents.

    Wellington • Since Jan 2007 • 1139 posts Report Reply

  • Jack Harrison, in reply to izogi,

    I guess I mean Adult media types, maybe its hard to read about your own industry, it is hard and usually not career rewarding but it needs to be explained.

    Don't dump it on the kids.

    wellington • Since Aug 2014 • 296 posts Report Reply

  • nzlemming, in reply to Dylan Reeve,

    …although I think the stolen hard drive that Slater received would be. Although I don’t think it was proven that it was stolen.

    Apparently a filing cabinet full of documents as well

    Waikanae • Since Nov 2006 • 2930 posts Report Reply

  • nzlemming, in reply to Dylan Reeve,

    So the victim(s) are left wing, the journalist is Slater, everything else is basically the same – are we still holding the same position? Slater isn’t being charged, but his communication with the hacker are being investigated as he’s a material witness.

    I'm neither left wing nor right, but I confess I don't see Slater as a journalist, regardless of what the judge said. If 5 policemen spent 10 hours in his home, taking everything they could find, yes I would call it excessive unless their warrant cited as grounds that there was a reasonable suspicion that he had hacked the information himself. Because we now know he's got form in that area. Nothing about Hager's previous activity as a journalist indicates that he has broken the law or been a party to the breaking of the law. Quite the contrary.

    If you' are going to offer up hypotheticals, at least make them equivalent.

    Waikanae • Since Nov 2006 • 2930 posts Report Reply

  • Jack Harrison,

    "Feral dies in Greymouth, did world a favour" - If that was your son? What would you do?

    In America that blogsite would be so shamed that it would have folded.

    This started this whole thing?

    wellington • Since Aug 2014 • 296 posts Report Reply

  • izogi, in reply to Jack Harrison,

    No problem with that.

    Sofie's comment just reminded me of the specific public school I attended, which was sadly the type of school where lots of kids were there because their parents had conveniently arranged for them to be in zone instead of because they necessarily cared about being there. From what I saw I'm fairly sure some of those influential parents wouldn't have been happy about compulsory reading of "those" sorts of books. :) I'm sure the odd teachers could easily slip it in with enthusiasm, but a formal policy of compulsory reading might be hard.

    Wellington • Since Jan 2007 • 1139 posts Report Reply

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