Posts by Bart Janssen
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OnPoint: Dear Labour Caucus, in reply to DCBCauchi,
Religions are incredibly rigid class structure. Even setting aside the exclusion of all those who don't believe exactly what you believe, then the priest class is very stratified with enormous barriers to entry.
Sure the ideology says everyone is equal but the practice of religion is very different from the ideology.
Whee politics and religion:)
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OnPoint: Dear Labour Caucus, in reply to DCBCauchi,
Class isn’t about categories, it’s about barriers to entry (we don’t invite those people) and barriers to exit (where were you? All the rest of the gang where there).
That’s why I believe we have an upper class, because I’ve seen the restricted entry groups in action.
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Upper middle class. No kids though which helps.
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OnPoint: Dear Labour Caucus, in reply to Sacha,
diffabled
like
I remember that thread ... mostly because of my difficulty in understanding.
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OnPoint: Dear Labour Caucus, in reply to Damian Christie,
it’s not like one day you get the keys to the executive washroom, not in NZ
Not quite so obviously perhaps, but I disagree with you about the spectrum. I don't think it's a smooth curve.
Of course there are always people who break "class barriers" and they are always used as an example of why there are no class barriers. But I believe that in New Zealand if you are born into the right family and get entry into the right school your path to wealth is very much enhance irrespective of your actual ability. And vice versa for our lower classes.
That to me anyway defines class.
Given our household income I doubt I fit into middle class and if I were to have children they would by that starting point not be middle class either.
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We do have an upper class, or perhaps a privileged class might be a better term. Instead of being defined by accents it is defined by knowledge ... and not my kind of knowledge.
It's called networking and is consists of being told (quietly) that so-and-so is about to announce X and now would be a good time to by shares in ... Or being told that a certain council is about to change it's zoning and now would be a good time to ... Or being invited to dinner with Y so you can convince them that changing that law would be good for ...
Those circles of networking are largely closed in New Zealand. That barrier to entry is what, for me, defines a "class". It can be broken down by people with drive and determination and luck.
We also have several lower classes, we have lower classes defined by race (sharp intake of breath), by health (including diffabled people), by place (East coast anyone) and more ... sadly.
Is it useful to talk about class? I'm not sure. Personally I prefer to focus on actual things that make changes and determine if those changes are likely to have a positive effect ... based on evidence and data. But I can see that the discussion of the class itself may identify places where changes might make differences.
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OnPoint: Dear Labour Caucus, in reply to Russell Brown,
Because they have no clear answers.
Facts and clearly right answers are useful but sometimes boring ... discussing how we discuss is actually interesting because it exposes assumptions people have about conversation and communication. Or at least I find it interesting :).
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OnPoint: Dear Labour Caucus, in reply to Sacha,
people get defensively prickly about class labels
People sometimes get defensive because of tone rather than content. Especially if their own resilience is low for whatever reason.
What I hear in my head when I read what you write is hardly ever what you heard in your head as you put fingers to keyboard.
At the pub you read someone's face and body and tone and still get it wrong sometimes.
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Consumption text
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wafer-thinking