Posts by robbery
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that you didn't imply I was making it up
no I don't think you make it up, i think you read it in a certain way, and you are very very negative about rianz at the moment.
i read your comment as another log on the RIANZ burning wood pile.
Re your comment which I think you'll agree is pretty inflammatory
They also give the impression they'd rather see original masters rot than have Archives NZ store them.Sigh ...
I still haven't heard clear and detailed reason for it. you said people in the public sector had said majors majors had given this impression. how what why whom. are they not capable of storing their own masters?
I need to know what tapes and why before I can summon up the resentment required to hate rianz and love archives.
and there's plenty of other work to be going on with before getting upset that some players won't let Archives have the remaining cards they need to complete their collectors set.I've visited sound archives in chch a few times and know a number of the people that work there.
I know they're not the same people as Nat Lib but they're part of the same game and I was commenting on how that game was played.
I see archives as a very different beast to nat lib. I don't even know if I think they should be trying to acquire masters that are still in play. Save that which needs to be saved and keep an eye on that which isn't ready to be put in a box just yet.preserving material is quite different from acquiring master tapes. I gave john a swag of Robbins recordings reels that came past me. don't know what was on them but I think that might have been the studio that the vauxhalls recorded at. The tapes weren't marked clearly unfortunately and it was more than I could handle to go through them. That's the sort of job I see archives as doing.
I haven't given them any of my original recordings to preserve and won't until I'm bored with them.
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I'd be obliged if you just took my word for that.
Why would I want to do that when I have perfectly good personal experience to go on?
its an incredibly vague generalisation which makes it look like you're talking about the entirety of recorded music all being represented by this RIANZ organisation and they're objecting to the good hearted NZ archivists who only want to preserve our art for the public good.Be specific. is it the flying nun catalogue we're talking about. the propellor catalogue? its certainly not everything because I've been easily archiving material from many places, more than I can handle with very little in the way of rianz issues.
perhaps you could take me at my word when I tell you that RIANZ do not speak for a huge swag of important historical recordings in NZ. Much great stuff was done off individuals own backs and this is the stuff that is most at risk, cos its sitting on peoples basements getting damaged, not in some swank storage rooms at major label hq's.
How do I know this? cos I've been dealing with many of them over the last 10 years.its painted so black and white in your comment but each one of those tapes will have a different story to it. You can't just say "bring all culture here cos we're looking after it now".
Where were archives when the EMI pressing plant were biffing masters into the cook strait?
how bout Archives offer a home for masters that are no longer being looked after by others. Maybe the RIANZ members who had masters were quite happy to look after their property all on their own in a sufficiently safe storage environment? leave an open invitation to them that when they're bored with housing their own tapes Archives will front. That''d be a fair solution rather than spreading notions that "RIANZ is evil and don't care bout culture"I personally think NZ Archives present approach is poorly thought out. They've stomped into the playing field with less disposable budget than they had when Alexander Turnball library were buying 2 of everything. Now the national library demand under threat of fine ($5000) if you don't comply that you give them 2 of everything at your expense. Charming.
If our country really was serious about preserving our recorded history (both aural and visual) then perhaps they should be purchasing these things for the nation as art galleries do paintings and sculptures rather than the "I'm skint, can ya spare an artwork brotha" approach.
Maybe they could try working a little more with the community to educate inform and serve it rather than command it.
just a thought.
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They also give the impression they'd rather see original masters rot than have Archives NZ store them. Sigh ...
care to back up that vague assertion with the comments that led you to believe it?
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but it is a bit rich taking me to task for something you do yourself, robbery.
and you take me to task for it where you can. I'm learning from the expert,
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And unfair to Mark.
I bet mark's enjoying this, but of all the people in this discussion mark is probably the one who can defend himself perfectly adequately and is thick skinned enough to acknowledge the comment, take it on board and/or disregard it...... or let it burn like a hot coal in the back of his mind eternally,
I'm guessing the first one.
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many many others it hurts.
I am referring to the internet in its present half tamed wild west state.
its moved along way from no control (note: filtering of illegal newsgroups and removal of criminal content), but it is still untamed in many aspects that are against the law and infringe on peoples legal rights.
I'm not passing comment on that, merely noting it. -
But is it so broke that it's not a wonderfully useful tool? No ...
it certainly needs fixing.
I've noticed a trend away from being tied to the email in box for some. if you want something from these people you have to phone them.
then there's the mobile phone people who do have them but never answer them or switch them off regularly.
These are recent trends.But that's the point.
Well its not the whole point is it. just one facet of it. I'm not denying that some people do make innovative use of the tool, but hopefully you can concede that for those it works for there are many many others it hurts.
also it might help to compare the bright present with the bright past.Fat Freedy's rep wasn't built on the internet. it was build on their relentless touring. neither was chris knox's come to think of it, and Chris's reaction to anything isn't necessarily the norm. He is a wonderfully oblique and sometimes self destructive (I'm thinking of the self lacerations of the enemy) individual. Holding him up as an example of the normal response to copyright infringement is almost meaningless.
You were criticising Mark for making generalisations,
I wasn't trying to make a personal attack on mark, I like him and his discussion,
but I was also responding to others comments along the same lines, comments you chose not to engage them on, just me,
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Rob, your last comment is pointless trolling.
right,... I did have point. ambiguity was that point. it was light hearted, take it as that and not mention it is another option, as you do to similar comments by others all the time.
Please try and make a contribution.
geez, its like a sweat shop in here. I'm working as hard as I can but I gotta earn a living in the real world too you know.
it can't all be gold but you seem to doubt me sincerity in attempting to be earnest and honest. you're wrong.Why don't we have our own secret and separate thread for this. You make it and I'll show up.
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You're ragging on Mark for making generalisations,
oh, we're back to you and me again?, sorry, what's the issue now?
but to say it's "as difficult as it ever was" in a general sense is just not true.
well actually it is.
sure we've got another communication tool but getting lost in the mass of media released up on the world is actually worse now than it was under the rule of labels for wider recognition as duly noted by kerry who summed it nicely thus...To suggest that artists can simply cut out the middle man and market their own work online is simplistic.
its worse for the consumer cos they have to wade through miles (kms) of material that earnest artists think is the bee knees (and you'd be surprised at how many people think their brand of dull is the next chart topper), and worse for the artist who's material really is the bees knees and has the even more difficult task of drawing attention to their truly great works in a sea of noise clogged by mass self belief.
There are more best kept secrets now than there ever were purely because of the noise floor of 'listen to me listen to me" pleas flooding the channels. Its actually easier to 'release' a great recording and get it overlook purely cos the job of marketing has been billed as something the individual can do after they've recorded and released their own product.
Email and the internet just made it easier to make a noise people can ignore. If you've got a myspace page or 30 you'll be inundated with artists friending you with the comment "check out my new songs". after looking at the first few the response is "who the fuck are you and why should I" and we're back to square one.
definitely the net offers the possibility of advance, but its early days yet and we could well fuck it all up.
email is a perfect example. spam and faulty spam filters are clogging in boxes and deleting legitimate mail. not perfection yet.
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I've never claimed that.
no, its just an impression.
or is it
My views are shared by a lot of people online and off,
or is it not
but I'm not their representative.
the politician comment gains strength. :p