Hard News by Russell Brown

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Hard News: Jones: The contender leaves

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  • Russell Brown,

    Kelvin Davis has published a Facebook post expanding on his comments about confronting violence against women and listing his other priorities as an MP.

    I don't recall anything of this clarity and purpose from Shane Jones in nine years.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 22848 posts Report Reply

  • bmk, in reply to William Leander,

    On the other hand, we have men (more than one) saying how they wives and other women won't be supporting Labour because of the way the new Labour leader dresses.

    If you are referring to me - I wasn't saying that. My partner found the way he appeared smarmy and fake most off-putting and untrustworthy. She hasn't yet decided who to vote for and could well end up voting for Labour - this though would appear to be in spite of Cunliffe than because of it. The dress comment was made in passing rather than being the substantial thrust of her criticisms - which were more to do with both his mannerisms and what he said than what he was wearing.

    As for Kelvin Davis I think it's great that he's back in - he's an incredibly impressive candidate. However, it's criminal that he wasn't in before - he should have had a much higher list placing last election.

    Since Jun 2010 • 327 posts Report Reply

  • Rob Hosking, in reply to Craig Ranapia,

    If you obligingly providing a ten car pile up, it’s a little rich to complain when people slow down to look.)

    Yup. And bloody hell, the number of business folk I used to hear complaining about the awful left wing pro-Labour NZ Herald would make you weep.

    South Roseneath • Since Nov 2006 • 830 posts Report Reply

  • Sofie Bribiesca,

    Meanwhile last night Key's enjoying dinner at the Act Party fundraiser for Seymour.So many dinners So little time.

    here and there. • Since Nov 2007 • 6796 posts Report Reply

  • Kumara Republic, in reply to bmk,

    As for Kelvin Davis I think it’s great that he’s back in – he’s an incredibly impressive candidate. However, it’s criminal that he wasn’t in before – he should have had a much higher list placing last election.

    Absolutely. Again, the dead wood issue comes into play, and the Boag approach won't necessarily work for the existing Labour caucus due to faction balance politics.

    There seems to be a life cycle of certain MP's careers: novice backbencher, experienced front-bencher, and then dead wood.

    The southernmost capital … • Since Nov 2006 • 5441 posts Report Reply

  • Sofie Bribiesca,

    If you look at the list of list MPs in Labour , all up, there is only about 9 list MPs. The rest were put there by the voting public. So Kelvin at 10 isn't that far down.Whoever you think of as "deadwood" has earnt their right to be there. There are not too many on the List. It'll be interesting to see how convenient voting is, as many in rural areas cant even afford the return trips in petrol to voting booths up north. Kelvin will have to encourage the voters up there. I'll see if I can help closer to the time.

    here and there. • Since Nov 2007 • 6796 posts Report Reply

  • NBH, in reply to Kumara Republic,

    Again, the dead wood issue comes into play

    Can I just ask who exactly constitutes the 'dead wood' that's supposed to be dominating Labour? Aside from Jones (and for all that I loathe the guy and am glad he's leaving, the supermarkets issue was a really good one to jump on), I can see an argument for Clayton Cosgrove, Mallard, and Damien O'Connor (though the last has a seat for life and from what I've heard is genuinely well-thought of as a constituency MP). Phil Goff and Annette King might have come in during the 80s, but both have excellent command of their portfolios and Goff's work around the MFAT restructuring and Defence has been really good.

    So aren't we really talking about three MPs out of 34, two of whom are now firmly on the backbenches? I guess you could bump that up to five if you included Ruth Dyson and Ross Robertson, but again they're both unranked and won't be making the trip back up anytime soon.

    Wellington • Since Oct 2008 • 97 posts Report Reply

  • Sacha, in reply to Sofie Bribiesca,

    there is only about 9 list MPs. The rest were put there by the voting public

    All MPs are put in place by the voting public. If voters do not like a party's list, they do not vote for them.

    Ak • Since May 2008 • 19740 posts Report Reply

  • bmk, in reply to Sofie Bribiesca,

    So Kelvin at 10 isn't that far down.Whoever you think of as "deadwood" has earnt their right to be there.

    How have they earnt the right to be there? By being in the party for so long? I think Kelvin made more of an impression than many on the list above him, not saying they aren't good MPs but either they are less effective, less promising or have had their time and should have been below him in the list. For example these were MPs above him in on the list who easily could have been placed lower down:
    Sue Moroney (10th) - vaguely heard of her but can't think of one really positive thing she's done.
    Darien Fenton (18th) - heard of her but again can't think of much she's done.
    Rajen Prasad (20th) - heard of but only in terms of his laziness, ineffectiveness and jokes about him being one of the worst MPs - yet he was higher than many worthy candidates.
    Raymond Hao (21st) - vaguely heard of.
    Carol Beaumont (22) - heard of but mainly only for losing the former Labour safe seat of Maungakiekie in 2008; a feat which rewards her a higher list placing in 2011.

    All of these could have been placed below Kelvin Davis. Maybe my perspective is skewed by him being a fellow Northlander - but if you've heard him speak he is very impressive and just the type of person Labour needs representing their party.

    Since Jun 2010 • 327 posts Report Reply

  • Russell Brown,

    So my ironic tweet …

    Labour must recapture the appeal to blue-collar males it had during those nine years in government led by a feminist PolSci lecturer.

    … got about 50 RTs earlier. One of which came to the attention of Trevor Mallard, who replied thus:

    @publicaddress @torshin but some of us had to punch above our weight for that team

    Oh really. Do tell.

    It seems well past time for Mallard to move on.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 22848 posts Report Reply

  • Russell Brown, in reply to bmk,

    All of these could have been placed below Kelvin Davis. Maybe my perspective is skewed by him being a fellow Northlander – but if you’ve heard him speak he is very impressive and just the type of person Labour needs representing their party.

    Couldn't agree more. I liked him first time around and I've only become more impressed in the last day.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 22848 posts Report Reply

  • Sofie Bribiesca, in reply to NBH,

    Ross is retiring and Ruth won her electorate, Mallard won his, O'Connor won his, Goff won his, King won hers, I can go on. Point being these people were voted in by their Electorate. They didn't think they were deadwood and it was their choice. Cosgrove is the only List MP out of those mentioned.

    If voters do not like a party’s list, they do not vote for them.

    Yep but My Party vote is that. Party vote.

    here and there. • Since Nov 2007 • 6796 posts Report Reply

  • Sacha, in reply to Sofie Bribiesca,

    Your party vote supports that party's list, minus electorate MPs. It's not a novel observation that Labour's list in 2008 was skewed and when their overall vote collapsed, MPs with low list rankings were excluded.

    Ak • Since May 2008 • 19740 posts Report Reply

  • Idiot Savant, in reply to Rich of Observationz,

    I reckon it would be useful to OAI the details on Jones' new job (announced yet?).

    Oh, I will be.

    Palmerston North • Since Nov 2006 • 1716 posts Report Reply

  • BenWilson, in reply to Russell Brown,

    @publicaddress @torshin but some of us had to punch above our weight for that team

    Oh really. Do tell.

    He's talking about when he bashed Henare, despite being the little guy.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 10657 posts Report Reply

  • NBH, in reply to Sofie Bribiesca,

    Point being these people were voted in by their Electorate. They didn't think they were deadwood and it was their choice.

    Oh totally - I was just responding to the commonly-articulated view that the Labour caucus consists primarily of 90-year old Roger Douglas clones who spend their days twiddling their thumbs in high-backed armchairs. The whole deadwood discussion seems like an unhelpful distraction to me.

    Wellington • Since Oct 2008 • 97 posts Report Reply

  • Pete George, in reply to BenWilson,

    I don't know if Mallard's 'punch' comment was deliberate regarding his Henare stoush, but note that he said "had to punch above our weight for that team" - past tense.

    How long ago? What does he do now?

    Dunedin • Since Dec 2011 • 139 posts Report Reply

  • Sofie Bribiesca, in reply to Sacha,

    But I also accept that the Party has more control than me with the list and accept it as it stands. Anyway Sacha ,I am happy that Kelvin is jumping in boots and all. Lets hope we can lift the Northland vote.

    here and there. • Since Nov 2007 • 6796 posts Report Reply

  • Ian Dalziel, in reply to Russell Brown,

    Maimai Vice II

    It seems well past time for Mallard to move on.

    Would it be churlish (or even actionable) to note then,
    the irony of Duck Season opening on May Day?

    I think someone already got
    the Northern Shoveler,
    Shelduck'll be right
    and Paradise is next!

    The buckshot stops where?

    Christchurch • Since Dec 2006 • 7950 posts Report Reply

  • Sofie Bribiesca, in reply to NBH,

    The whole deadwood discussion seems like an unhelpful distraction to me.

    Yes me too. Age is relative and they probably have relatives and some would say.. they are old or young and I don't know anyones age here so ....;)

    here and there. • Since Nov 2007 • 6796 posts Report Reply

  • BenWilson, in reply to Pete George,

    How long ago? What does he do now?

    He hung up his gloves, and makes the other guys chase chickens around to increase their agility.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 10657 posts Report Reply

  • Sacha, in reply to BenWilson,

    bless his lycra leggings.
    that's what our parliament needs more of.

    Ak • Since May 2008 • 19740 posts Report Reply

  • Ian Dalziel, in reply to NBH,

    Raylan meets Lovejoy

    The whole deadwood discussion seems like an unhelpful distraction...

    That's funny, there was always lots of swearing and violence to liven things up when it was on the telly... but yes, it was distracting.

    NSFW, Children, sheltered adults or in front of horses...

    </helpful>
    ;- )

    Christchurch • Since Dec 2006 • 7950 posts Report Reply

  • Kumara Republic, in reply to Sofie Bribiesca,

    But I also accept that the Party has more control than me with the list and accept it as it stands. Anyway Sacha ,I am happy that Kelvin is jumping in boots and all. Lets hope we can lift the Northland vote.

    The leaders' primary was just a starting point for rightly devolving power from the caucus.

    The southernmost capital … • Since Nov 2006 • 5441 posts Report Reply

  • Sofie Bribiesca, in reply to Ian Dalziel,

    NSFW, Children, sheltered adults or in front of horses…

    or Badgers...

    here and there. • Since Nov 2007 • 6796 posts Report Reply

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