Hard News by Russell Brown

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Hard News: Reassure Me: cannabis, polling and deliberative democracy

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  • Dennis Frank, in reply to BenWilson,

    I agree. The medicinal dimension is separate, since sufferers often need precisely-targeted medication. Anyone has a natural right to use natural products in whatever way they want. Social sanctions against misbehaviour that may result is a separate issue due to the propensity of some to mix weed with commercial drugs and/or synthetics. Escape from reality is for many driven by desperation, so the more ways they use to get out of it, the better. Or so it seems at the time.

    The grow-your-own ethic also derives from Castaneda (Teachings of Don Juan, 1970). The magic herb is chosen because it is an ally (on the path of gnosis). One toke oft serves to shift consciousness, so why would anyone sensible take more? Depends if you are someone trying to go deeper. More tokes may not get you there, may just derail you. You may need a different ally.

    Then there's our personal relation to nature (Gaia), which getting high always seems to bring to the fore. Oneness, epiphanies. Gardeners develop a personal relation to their plants. The ally & its use then become a spiritual thing grounded in praxis.

    New Zealand • Since Jun 2016 • 214 posts Report Reply

  • Joe Wylie, in reply to BenWilson,

    As with tobacco, which is piss easy to grow, I doubt that most people would bother.

    Tobacco certainly is "piss easy to grow". In Eastern Australia it's a common weed. Botanically speaking it's an oversized petunia. I suspect that the reason that dairy robbers haven't turned to cultivating the stuff is that it requires a hell of a lot more expertise and processing to render it smokeable than cannabis does.

    flat earth • Since Jan 2007 • 4585 posts Report Reply

  • steven crawford, in reply to Dennis Frank,

    The medicinal dimension is separate, since sufferers often need precisely-targeted medication.

    I know you don't mean these sufferers could be targets for television advertising.

    Wellington • Since Nov 2006 • 4015 posts Report Reply

  • Dennis Frank, in reply to steven crawford,

    Well, no, but I maybe get your implication. Corporate drug peddlers are unlikely to tell the truth. Sufferers are more likely to trust their doctor for accurate medication. Misplaced trust sometimes, of course!

    New Zealand • Since Jun 2016 • 214 posts Report Reply

  • BenWilson,

    You dry it out and shred it, or roll it into cigars.

    But yes, as with most tastes, people probably lock into favourites and would sorely miss all the yummy additives that are in commercial tobacco.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 10559 posts Report Reply

  • Joe Wylie, in reply to BenWilson,

    ...people probably lock into favourites and would sorely miss all the yummy additives that are in commercial tobacco.

    While cigarettes are commonly laced with additives to promote even burning, the last I looked these weren't common in rolling tobacco. Of course there's the odd horror like Port Royal, which is probably great if you like RTDs. The flavours that make tobacco palatable mostly come from slow oxidation in the curing process. Attempting to oven-dry the stuff a la cannabis produces a lung-wrecking nasty that, if it weren't for the addictive properties of nicotine, would put anyone off tobacco for life.

    flat earth • Since Jan 2007 • 4585 posts Report Reply

  • steven crawford, in reply to Dennis Frank,

    Sufferers are more likely to trust their doctor for accurate medication. Misplaced trust sometimes, of course!

    That has a lot to do with how advertising (particularly on television) is legally allowed.

    It wouldn’t be that difficult for anyone with enough money to creat a don’t listen to the doctor because the doctor doesn’t know much about dope idea. And dope is organic. But the people who know best are the people in the industry.

    Another of many, many things to think about is, if you have advertising that makes a point of informing people about how to report side affects, But that would only work if there was someware to report side affects with out having to pay to visit the doctor. So by simply using a disclaimer like: if you start suffering from unwanted side affects, please visit your doctor, wouldn’t be any good.

    But if the advertising regulaton is pushed more to the interests of public health and less the rights of business entity’s to do business…

    The whole advertising of medicines laws could get a good over now, at this cosmologicaly good time.

    Wellington • Since Nov 2006 • 4015 posts Report Reply

  • BenWilson, in reply to Joe Wylie,

    Yes, the concept of there being any level of refinement in the taste of tobacco smoke is something I have to take people’s word for, but I would pretty strongly suspect that acclimatization is a very big part of it. But we digress – I think it’s true that cannabis would be easier to grow and usefully harvest than tobacco, and there would probably be an initial flurry of interest after legalization, until mass produced volumes undermined the return from growing your own for all but hobbyists. The plant would probably end up, like tobacco, growing everywhere as a weed, but preferences would lock in on particular cultivars. It would soon stop being cool when it was neither uncommon nor rebellious to have, and the mucking around with a garden would end up being something old people like me would bore people talking about. Probably it would be next to the sage and rosemary in the gardens of old ladies with rheumatism, or in huge plantations.

    ETA: It's quite likely, IMHO, that smoking it at all would end up being far less common, at which point the whole thing of drying it out would fall by the wayside. For pain it would probably be eaten, and for recreation, vaporized. Both are much healthier than inhaling hot smoke.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 10559 posts Report Reply

  • Russell Brown, in reply to BenWilson,

    ETA: It’s quite likely, IMHO, that smoking it at all would end up being far less common, at which point the whole thing of drying it out would fall by the wayside. For pain it would probably be eaten, and for recreation, vaporized. Both are much healthier than inhaling hot smoke.

    I think so, especially as vaporisers get better and cheaper. I'm not sure about the way some jurisdictions aren't allowing concentrates for that reason.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 22537 posts Report Reply

  • BenWilson, in reply to Russell Brown,

    I’m not sure about the way some jurisdictions aren’t allowing concentrates for that reason.

    If the plant itself is legal, then concentrates are somewhat less of a high priority. Yes, of course they are more efficient, but they are also more...concentrated. I guess once doses are well controlled and understood that's less problematic, but people getting mega wasted as their first experience doesn't seem like a good idea. The main impediment to good portable vaporizers that simply take the herb itself is that it's not legal to carry the herb, or anything clearly used for taking it. If that changes, then a slower process for the introduction of concentrates doesn't seem like a dreadful thing.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 10559 posts Report Reply

  • Ian Dalziel, in reply to Russell Brown,

    I’m not sure about the way some jurisdictions aren’t allowing concentrates for that reason.

    Overheard, Auckland 2025:

    "Have you seen the price of cold-pressed cannabis oil at Farro?!"
    "I know!*
    Those plantation riots at Ruatoria really ramped up the market
    - and they're still restoring the rail link
    "

    *using the KimHillSottoVox© App

    Christchurch • Since Dec 2006 • 7704 posts Report Reply

  • Russell Brown, in reply to BenWilson,

    but people getting mega wasted as their first experience doesn’t seem like a good idea.

    Yeah, I know of one cannabis activist with a very prodigious capacity for consuming it who was knocked over by his first try of shatter. You only need a very little bit.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 22537 posts Report Reply

  • BenWilson, in reply to Russell Brown,

    You only need a very little bit.

    A very experienced user will probably be accustomed to getting a dosage far beyond what they actually wanted (I don't want to say overdose because that implies toxicity, which is not quite the same thing), and have some inkling that time will probably get them back down, whereas a first timer going sky high is likely to have a very bad trip, scaring the daylights out of them.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 10559 posts Report Reply

  • Dennis Frank,

    A fascinating Jim Mora interview here with Amanda Jones PhD, MSc, the kiwi ex-pat entrepreneur at the leading edge of the medicinal cannabis industry in California: https://www.radionz.co.nz/audio/player?audio_id=2018661684

    New Zealand • Since Jun 2016 • 214 posts Report Reply

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