Hard News: The Political Lie
177 Responses
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DexterX, in reply to
While they do less with more.
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DexterX, in reply to
It was Nat in 1975 and Lab in 2005 - typo - sorry.
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Steve Barnes, in reply to
Australia found ways to ensure everyone shares the responsibility and benefits of improving productivity.
I would call bullshit on that. The first Australians are still having their land grabbed for the benefit of the powerful.
And what a great deal they got "Give us your mineral rights and we might consider letting you have reticulated water or even electricity" -
Sacha, in reply to
Australia found ways to ensure everyone shares the responsibility and benefits of improving productivity.
I would call bullshit on that.
Let me be more specific:
Australia found ways to ensure workers, businesses and government share the responsibility and benefits of improving productivity.
Not meaning to imply anything about their nation's dubious record of indigenous marginalisation.
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recordari, in reply to
Australia found ways to ensure workers, businesses and government share the responsibility and benefits of improving productivity.
So why aren't we all moving to Australia? Oh wait, we are.
Note: Gross exaggeration, without any factual references, in keeping with the theme of this thread.
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Russell Brown, in reply to
I would call bullshit on that. The first Australians are still having their land grabbed for the benefit of the powerful.
I think you're talking about quite different things.
The neolibs are always implying that we'd become more like Australia by surrendering regulation and taking a brutal approach toward labour relations. This simply isn't what Australia has done.
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Then you have to consider the effect of Unionism in Australia, more along the lines of the Mafia style Unions in the USA rather that the worker driven Unions in the UK. This has the effect of marginalising the labour end of the work force into a form of slavery for the benefit of "Organised Labour".
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Alex Coleman, in reply to
The neolibs are always implying that we’d become more like Australia by surrendering regulation and taking a brutal approach toward labour relations.
The BRT is endlessly dull on this.
They keep saying that we stopped reforming when Lange had a cup of tea, and Australia just kept on truckin with the reforming, and here we are and there they are, and what does that tell you? That we need to keep reforming that’s what!
They don’t mention that Australia only got around to doing anything similar to the Employment Contracts Act until towards the end, (not coincidentally), of Howard’s government. It took them nearly that amount of time to sell Telstra as well.
I sometimes think they are not very honest people.
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Russell Brown, in reply to
I sometimes think they are not very honest people.
I would say that to their credit, they do seem to believe their own rhetoric.
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Sacha, in reply to
I sometimes think they are not very honest people.
Or spectacularly stupid. Either way, not a good reflection.
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For a bit of light relief, was this (h/t 3410) meant to veer between lame and outright offensive, or am I just more hip replacement than hip nowadays?
Pretty awful isn't it. Dunno who approved that as "good campaigning".
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Kumara Republic, in reply to
I would say that to their credit, they do seem to believe their own rhetoric.
Otherwise known as a religious cult.
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Due to changing circumstances I'm afraid I'll have to lie.
So if lies are the ball bearings that keep the machine ticking along.
Are we now in the new paradigm where we dont need oil?
And lying to a relly about their attire, or feeding your mut bikkies and matters of national importance are on a par? Shit anyone can do this politics business. The only problem seems to be you have to fool most of the population into believing you are holier than jesus( in a manner of speaking).I may have to go away and self-mythologize for a while.
Cause there seems to be a lot of people who have a BIG head start on me.
Just getting the right coloured spectacles on...
Oh, and a hammer to ...... bash myself in the crotch with.
That Jose he's a funny guy, love him.Consequentialism eh?
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There have been other great episodes of Media 7, Russell, but last nights was a great one of the "it's over already, can't you keep going?" type!
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Steve Barnes, in reply to
Pretty awful isn’t it. Dunno who approved that as “good campaigning”.
Well, I thought the person responsible would be the owner of the site but, apparently, mentioning that is "Offensive". Go figure.
Was going to link to Labours embarrassing effort but, with luck, it will be gone by lunchtime. -
Given we’re discussing political lies, it seems appropriate to mention that Lindsay Perigo has been hired to be John Boscowan’s press secretary, at least, according to John Hartevelt.
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Craig Ranapia, in reply to
Well, I thought the person responsible would be the owner of the site but, apparently, mentioning that is “Offensive”.
FFS, Steve, how about we hold the sodding Labour Party responsible since the authorisation statement was in the name of the party secretary-general and gave the address of the Labour's national office?
If Chris Flatt would like to assure me on the record that the whole thing is a fake, I'll take his word for it. But given the name of this thread, I warn the irony might make my head explode.
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Russell Brown, in reply to
There have been other great episodes of Media 7, Russell, but last nights was a great one of the “it’s over already, can’t you keep going?” type!
Thank you!
We did drop a Jose video track from the end of the show so the discussion could keep on running, but I know what you mean.
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Brian Edwards posts about the show and its topic.
In almost half a century of living in this country I can count on two hands (and with a finger or two to spare) the number of MPs found guilty of lying to Parliament. And if we’re talking about premeditated, shamefaced lying to us, the voters, the number probably isn’t much higher.
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nzlemming, in reply to
We did drop a Jose video track from the end of the show so the discussion could keep on running, but I know what you mean
The moment with the hammer was enough. Still wincing...
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Stephen Judd, in reply to
last nights was a great one of the “it’s over already, can’t you keep going?” type
Absolutely agree. It felt as though we were just getting started. I would have loved to go down the pub after and hear the rest.
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andin, in reply to
loved to go down the pub after and hear the rest.
Yep I would have liked to see it become more free flowing.
I blame time. -
Craig Ranapia, in reply to
Brian Edwards posts about the show and its topic.
Very interesting post, but I really hope Dr. Edwards isn't telling his political clients that it's somehow dirty pool to hold politicians to account for their own public statements and voting records. As I said way up-thread, I think folks are actually pretty reasonable. People are entitled to change their minds, but they're not entitled to act like they never changed them at all. And, yes, I think it's perfectly legitimate to ask Phil Goff why he voted to raise GST in 1989, but thinks it's evil incarnate now. Or when Comrade Key found his comfort zone with "communism by stealth." :)
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I don’t consider Politicians lie as little as Brian Edwards has stated on Media 7.
The "Political Lie" of the moments is the asset sales agenda and the lack of credible opposition. It is a worry that 2/3 rd of NZ voters are against asset sales yet National appear to be able to govern alone – Perhaps the biggest lie is the lie the electorate is telling itself.
That the assets sales are necessary to raise capital and reduce the deficit; bear in mind the proceeds from the proposed sales will only cover - was it I read somewhere - 14 weeks of the Govt's present spend – and if they want to change the situation where Kiwisaver funds can’t be invested locally in infrastructure then change the scheme.
The NZ dollar has risen to record highs against the US in part based on the speculation around the proposed asset sale - the markets are, it appears, already factoring in a National win, assets sales and significant Chinese investment in NZ as a certainty.
Perhaps the government borrowing more than they needed a few months ago when the NZ $ was low was to enable govt to effectively retire more govt debt when the $ is higher.
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Sofie Bribiesca, in reply to
Interesting too (I thought), was Joyce's words on The Nation yesterday when chatting about Telecom. I am going to watch it again but suffice to say I had visions of Enron style tactics. Bullshit baffles brains init. ;)
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