Hard News by Russell Brown

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Hard News: Because it's about time we had another coffee post

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  • recordari, in reply to Martin Lindberg,

    don't stir it then

    Later used in Barry Crump Toyota ad, right?

    AUCKLAND • Since Dec 2009 • 2607 posts Report Reply

  • Kumara Republic,

    Beyond the coffee-specific snarkiness of the article, there's a sense in which it fits into a typical neo-con trope: if you object to globalisation and corporatised homogenisation, then you're an elitist.

    It goes to show that peer pressure often persists long after high school graduation, and by the adult stage it's mutated into affluenza - or should that be "rat-racism"?. Thankfully we're immune to it for the most part.

    The southernmost capital … • Since Nov 2006 • 5446 posts Report Reply

  • Jacqui Dunn, in reply to giovanni tiso,

    One thing is recording a mistake, another saying that it's an acceptable alternative spelling. It isn't - at least not yet.

    I'd be inclined to put quotes around the word in question. But that's just me....

    Deepest, darkest Avondale… • Since Jul 2010 • 585 posts Report Reply

  • Jacqui Dunn, in reply to Russell Brown,

    Never heard of a vegan aioli ...

    Mm. Yerp. My mistake....I was totally focussed on the garlic.

    Deepest, darkest Avondale… • Since Jul 2010 • 585 posts Report Reply

  • Jacqui Dunn, in reply to HORansome,

    We're largely ovo-lacto vego, so eat cheese, yoghurt, eggs. I'm making gnocchi tonight, if anyone besides me is interested :))

    Deepest, darkest Avondale… • Since Jul 2010 • 585 posts Report Reply

  • Jacqui Dunn, in reply to Martin Lindberg,

    Oh, yes. Lions' tour circa 1959 - iirc - when hotel staff still brought in the early morning cuppa at 6-30 or thereabouts, and the tourists (players and journos alike) were like startled little jackrabbits. Something to write home about, apparently. And about that time many stories about "Tea! Do you take sugar? Oh, don't stir it then..."

    ETA: Can you guess I've just got back to my computer after several hours away?

    Deepest, darkest Avondale… • Since Jul 2010 • 585 posts Report Reply

  • Stephen Judd,

    Loved this article.

    Gabe: Well, Sbucks does not use bad coffee, in fact it is still considered specialty because it is Arabica, meaning it is grown at high elevations, and it is from a single-origin. But, by no means does specialty signify “good coffee.” Sbucks has gotten sooo big that they are now buying coffee from cooperatives (many different farms with varying degrees of quality), whereas the majority of the other roasters prefer to buy single-estate coffees (aka single farm coffees where quality is consistent and exact origin is available for the end consumer).

    Me: So they still get to say they’re “specialty,” but in reality they’ve lost some rights to this claim. They’ve just grown too big.

    Gabe: Yeah. They have already lost a lot of customers to McDonalds/ McCafe due to quality and price. McDonalds has better coffee.

    Me: Whoa, really?

    Gabe: Yeah, McDs has won numerous blind tasting competitions and they have cheaper prices.

    Me: In terms of the bean, what’s the diff? And have you participated in these competitions?**

    Gabe: In my opinion the difference between the two is not so much the bean, but the way they roast. McDonalds has an outside company roast their beans for them that solely focuses on roasting whereas SBbucks roasts for themselves and I feel has become complacent and lacks innovation in terms of blending and adding new flavors.

    Wellington • Since Nov 2006 • 3122 posts Report Reply

  • Gareth Ward,

    As you say Russell, some troubling points for an analyst to be making - he correctly notes that Starbucks had to shutter about 1,000 (!) stores out the back of the recession, but they aren't really reopening those, anywhere.

    And their earnings appreciation is actually largely being driven from their strategic plans to push more branded product through channels OTHER than their own store (e.g. instant coffee out of supermarkets).
    The push into China and India is so obvious that it's not really an amazement to the market.

    Auckland, NZ • Since Mar 2007 • 1727 posts Report Reply

  • Joe Wylie, in reply to Jacqui Dunn,

    We’re largely ovo-lacto vego, so eat cheese, yoghurt, eggs.

    And no longer moderately advanced but cowardly.

    flat earth • Since Jan 2007 • 4593 posts Report Reply

  • nzlemming, in reply to Stephen Judd,

    Go big or go home

    Awesome slogan!

    Waikanae • Since Nov 2006 • 2937 posts Report Reply

  • Christopher Dempsey, in reply to Islander,

    A swap would be grand Islander - my email address is pretty findable on the net.

    Parnell / Tamaki-Auckland… • Since Sep 2008 • 659 posts Report Reply

  • Christopher Dempsey, in reply to webweaver,

    Bidding on orginial poster artwork from Midnight Espresso? Priceless!! Well done for winning that bid... I well remember the original artwork going up...

    Parnell / Tamaki-Auckland… • Since Sep 2008 • 659 posts Report Reply

  • peterpeasant,

    If that is an example of analysis from GMI I am never going to heed any advice from that quarter.

    Coffee is not about snobbery, it is about drinking stuff one likes, at a convenient location and possibly socialising.

    I live near a small provincial town, population less than 20,000.

    This hamlet has 12 coffee outlets.

    Quality ranges from sublime to gorblimey.

    Out of that 12 four make really good coffee and take pride in doing just that.

    Out of that 12 four make pretty poor coffee.

    The remainder make acceptable coffee.

    How the hell was Starbucks going to compete in NZ cities with stats like that.

    If Field is a genuine analyst he ought to have started from the question actually what is Starbucks actually selling?

    Field seems to have forgotten that in a free market economy the customer is always right.

    Starbucks was successful in the USA partly because most coffee was pretty bad and the yanks love sweet sweet sweet comfort food.

    Most of the rest of us on this planet live in rather more robust circumstances.

    It is clearly time that Mr Field descended from his ivory tower and observed what is actually happening.

    new zealand • Since Oct 2010 • 39 posts Report Reply

  • Rich of Observationz,

    [midnight expresso] continue to make you wait for your order at the counter

    That's one reason I go there - they make coffee while you wait and hence you never have to wait that long. At other cafes (e.g. Fidel's) you can sit down and have a random wait of five minutes to half an hour before your drink appears, and often it can be beaten by your food, which is unacceptable.

    Also, by some magic, I've nearly always found a seat. Possibly the service time is in perfect equilibrium with the average consumption time, leading to a seat always coming free. A mathematician with expertise in queuing theory may want to make a study of this effect.

    Back in Wellington • Since Nov 2006 • 5550 posts Report Reply

  • giovanni tiso, in reply to Rich of Observationz,

    and often it can be beaten by your food, which is unacceptable

    Also far too violent. It's not OK.

    Wellington • Since Jun 2007 • 7473 posts Report Reply

  • Scott A,

    I like filter coffee...

    ...ok, yes, ostracise me, sue me, exile me, cast me aside from the richly dark espresso holes in your heart. But I like it.

    And one thing that I, as a Wellington civil servant, who lives and works in the city centre has found, over the last five or so years... is you just can't get decent filter coffee anywhere, any more.

    Because espresso has killed it. And the few cafes left in the inner city that still have a bubbling percolator disdain it, disown it, and don't care if the coffee going in, or out, is of a drinkable status. Because, as we all know, everyone drinks espresso.

    So, as a filter coffee lover, I have to find the 'near est-enough' substitute. That which tastes close enough. And, as the GIs found in Europe in the 1940s and 1950s, there is a way espresso can be made to resemble filter - the Americano, where the hot water is poured over (not under) the espresso shot. It's a simple difference between an americano and a long black, but it is an important one, with regards to crema, consistency and flavour.

    I love filter coffee, as I have said. And I now have to seek out decent americanos because it is damn near impossible to find a good americano in downtown wellington, due to the obsessive snobbery involved with hissing, spitting espresso machines.

    Except Starbucks. Starbucks, of all the coffee places near my work, do a damn great americano. It's almost like having a filter coffee to your taste. But we're not allowed to do that anymore, in these enlightened times.

    The wilds of Kingston, We… • Since May 2009 • 133 posts Report Reply

  • Paul Campbell,

    Well any US diner will have a pot there, it's probably been there all day - many US cafes though went through a filter coffee thing about 5 years ago - filter coffee came back - but instead of just pulling the joe off from where it was steaming they would make it to order, they installed little rows of funnels on the counter and would pour a measured amount of the coffee of your choice and let you grab it when it was done - this was particularly common at places that roast their own - it was a bit of a passing fad many of those rows of cones are now gone

    Dunedin • Since Nov 2006 • 2623 posts Report Reply

  • BenWilson, in reply to Scott A,

    Dude, there's no shame in filter coffee. It's good if you want to make strong coffee and there's way less arsing around. It should really be cheaper on that score, and if it was, I'm sure there would be more times I'd drink it in a shop. Most weeks I'll have a couple of cups of it, usually at lunch with my wider family, where everyone wants a coffee, and more importantly, they want to have it with each other, rather than staggered at 2 minute intervals, or even 3-5 if you're making latte.

    I think it got a bad name here because of too many shops selling stuff that had been sitting on a warming element for hours. It should still be freshly made, and with good beans.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 10657 posts Report Reply

  • Kris V,

    wow... one of my favourite rant subjects (espresso & coffee snobbery) and I'm exhausted by the time I'm done reading the whole ten pages of comments ;p

    some quick notes before sleep:
    went tripping round the globe last year, never stepped foot in a Starbucks while in the US. I was quite proud of that as the bloody things were everywhere.
    London... saw some crimes against coffee while there (another day perhaps)
    Costas.... their flat white was disappoint. agree with the earlier comment that it looked kinda ok (large cup tho) but tasted weak and bland
    Monmouth (Borough Market) found while wandering and remembered it was on my Kiwi friend's 'recommended' list. eureka. worth the wait.

    Chch.... I only recommend C4HQ (now on Tuam St). Friendly personal service, locally roasted beans. I buy a kg of C4 Stout beans every week, as the only other place I drink espresso is the very non-public establishment of my place with my trusty 2group La San Marco.

    I'm a barista (years of experience, cafes & mobile) and total coffee snob, I freely admit it. In fact the only good thing to come out of the recent seismic down here may well be the opportunity to properly plumb in our beasty into a brand new kitchen. At the moment it lives in the garage but one day it will take pride of place.
    one day, my preciousssssss

    Shakeytown • Since Nov 2008 • 61 posts Report Reply

  • Gareth Ward,

    A kg a week for a home machine! I'm glad you werent shaking so much as to be unable to type that post :)

    Auckland, NZ • Since Mar 2007 • 1727 posts Report Reply

  • Biobbs,

    Very long time lurker here - finally drawn out of the woodwork by a coffee thread. Yes!

    More ChCh props: I've always had great coffee at Ground Floor cafe in Riccarton Rd. Cornershop Bistro in Sumner is also excellent every time. Was a regular weekend haunt of mine. I've had some great coffees at the Honeypot in Lichfield St, but it depends on which barista is on duty - ditto Vivace in Hereford St and the Coffee Shop on Montreal across from the Arts Centre. But yeah, it's surprising there aren't more reliable places in a main centre.

    For several years I was making regular work trips to Hamilton and found two places with fantastic coffee: Rocket (in Hamilton East) and Machina.(but again, in both places it depended on who was behind the counter). Machina also made (still does?) _great_ bacon rolls for breakfast. Every other place I ever tried in Hamilton, the coffee was utterly foul.

    And some more 1980s Auckland nostalgia: The best filter coffee in Auckland back then, and perhaps ever, was at Nicholas Nickleby in High St, near where Unity Books is now. They also had the best food ever served at any of the old-school tearooms. Their neenish tarts were the size of a saucer, and their pies were to die for. Great atmosphere too, down in the basement and with booths that had really comfy seats.

    It really is astonishing to remember how hard it was back then to find anywhere in the central city to have dinner. I was a grad student at uni, often working til 7.30 or 8 in the evening, and wanting to grab a bite somewhere central before catching the bus home to Balmoral from outside the St James. The restaurant scene was well and truly under way in Ponsonby and Parnell, but the city centre? Fuggeddaboutit. Although there was the Parrot Cafe (sic?) downstairs in The Corner, which used to make a brillint lasagne that I became addicted to.

    Coffeewise, I love me my long black, and find the notion of contaminating coffee with milk or anything else quite revolting. But I'd also add my voice to those supporting the humble plunger, which is all I have at home - as someone said earlier, as long as you grind the beans freshly, use water that is hot but not boiling, and buy good coffee (my current favourite is Costa Rica), you can make it just as nice as any machine (admittedly without a real crema). Oh, and grind the beans relatively coarsely and let the coffee extract for at least 10 minutes - I promise you, that makes a huge difference.

    The River Mouth, Denmark • Since Jan 2011 • 114 posts Report Reply

  • BenWilson,

    Welcome Biobbs. Plungers are good, except for the one design flaw - they are quite dangerous. Who has not experienced or seen one of them suddenly releasing a large squirt of hot coffee all over the person pressing it down? The solution is to keep the filter clean, which isn't really that easy, since it's coffee oil filling all the little holes, so it's not just a matter of scrubbing it with detergent. I discovered recently that dishwashers do a good job. Anyone out there got advice for those without a dishwasher? I never solved that.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 10657 posts Report Reply

  • Sam F, in reply to Scott A,

    And one thing that I, as a Wellington civil servant, who lives and works in the city centre has found, over the last five or so years... is you just can't get decent filter coffee anywhere, any more.

    Sympathies. But if you ever find yourself lost and caffeine-depleted in Auckland's CBD, teeny little "Our Cafe" (on the corner of Swanson and Hobson Streets) does great filter coffee. They hand you the cup, coffee and hot plate's there, milk's in the fridge behind you... think it's about $2.20 from memory. Nice people there too.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 1611 posts Report Reply

  • Dismal Soyanz, in reply to BenWilson,

    I have a plunger by my desk for when I feel motivated enough but too stingy to go buy outside. I clean it by hand – a squirt of dishwashing liquid and a little patience with one of those long-handled scrubbing brush. And lots of hot water. Like I say, only when I feel motivated….

    ETA: I always thought you were meant to press the plunger slowly, no?

    Wellington • Since Nov 2010 • 310 posts Report Reply

  • Leopold,

    You filter coffee drinkers think you have it tough... what about us tea drinkers? All you seem to get these days, is a teabag ... the doffeee equivalent of instant - oh for decent teashop, specialisng in serving properly made teas...

    Since Jan 2007 • 153 posts Report Reply

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