Legal Beagle by Graeme Edgeler

Read Post

Legal Beagle: Gordon Campbell @GordonCampbell_ #GordonCampbell

26 Responses

First ←Older Page 1 2 Newer→ Last

  • Graeme Edgeler,

    Those wondering about the title of this article, probably haven't read the Twitter account that has been set up for Gordon, presumably by someone from Scoop.

    Wellington, New Zealand • Since Nov 2006 • 3202 posts Report Reply

  • Andre,

    I liked his reasoning which still stands even though (obviously) many of his facts were wrong. CK Stead's 'Smith's Dream' was written in the Muldoon era but the situation it describes seems much more likely today than it did then in my opinion.

    New Zealand • Since May 2009 • 350 posts Report Reply

  • Ian Dalziel, in reply to Andre,

    'Smith's Dream'

    Perhaps TV3 could put Sleeping Dogs on the telly for the masses
    (I can't see the Gov't owned ones running it at the moment)
    and it is such a groundbreaking film for NZ, serious story, great soundtrack, first feature for Roger Donaldson, and early movie for Michael Seresin, great vehicle for the young Sam Neill and Ian Mune, et al - so why not a groundbreaker for social change, now, as well
    and if TV3 or the others won't show it at least NZ on Screen has the trailer
    Go get popcorn for cop porn now...

    Christchurch • Since Dec 2006 • 7886 posts Report Reply

  • James Butler, in reply to Graeme Edgeler,

    Those wondering about the title of this article

    I call dibs on this gag.

    Auckland • Since Jan 2009 • 856 posts Report Reply

  • Peter Graham,

    Sleeping Dogs is on Youtube. I don't know if the copyright owners have given permission or not.

    Christchurch • Since Jul 2011 • 39 posts Report Reply

  • Graeme Edgeler, in reply to James Butler,

    I call dibs on this gag.

    I did wonder if the name should appear four times :-)

    Wellington, New Zealand • Since Nov 2006 • 3202 posts Report Reply

  • Kumara Republic, in reply to Ian Dalziel,

    Perhaps TV3 could put Sleeping Dogs on the telly for the masses

    Why stop at Sleeping Dogs?

    The southernmost capital … • Since Nov 2006 • 5415 posts Report Reply

  • Yoza,

    "No reason is given as to why the Attorney-General is the Government’s “legal puppet”, and I would have thought that the fact Chris Finlayson is making so many reports suggests he probably isn’t a puppet..."

    The premise that Chris Finlayson, National Party MP and a Cabinet minister for the current regime, is somehow not a compliant actor in implementing policy seems far more ridiculous than suggesting he is a puppet.

    There are so few journalists in New Zealand that are prepared to critically analyse the dogmatic agenda of Labour /National public management systems that it is interesting to see who is prepared to go after those journalists that do.

    I think this critique of Campbell's extensive article appears to be less of an analysis than an attempted character assassination. So much so that Farrar has gleefully linked to it on his blog -. http://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/2013/08/tidbits-2.html

    There is a deep seated institutional abhorrence of dissenting voices throughout the New Zealand establishment, most noticeably from those who would lay claim to possessing liberal views.

    I imagine someone as fearless as Gordon Campbell has many enemies festering amid the ranks of National, Labour, the public service and the corporate sector.

    I doubt he will be losing any sleep worrying about a few minor points not meeting Edgeler's exacting standards.

    Wellington • Since Oct 2007 • 12 posts Report Reply

  • andin,

    4. Token Bill of Rights Act (BORA

    ) yeah No. 4 The last one.

    overall thesis

    Well Im not sure

    No reason is given as to why the Attorney-General is the Government’s “legal puppet”, and I would have thought that the fact Chris Finlayson is making so many reports suggests he probably isn’t a puppet.

    Or not!

    Farrar has gleefully linked to it

    Talking in tongues... I hope

    raglan • Since Mar 2007 • 1881 posts Report Reply

  • Rob Hosking,

    I would love to see those who don't agree with Graeme's post provide some on-point rebuttal, instead of links to films and character assassination.

    Anyone ???

    South Roseneath • Since Nov 2006 • 830 posts Report Reply

  • Ian Dalziel, in reply to Rob Hosking,

    instead of links to films

    Que? I wasn't disagreeing with Graeme, merely a tangential aside triggered by another comment...

    Christchurch • Since Dec 2006 • 7886 posts Report Reply

  • "chris", in reply to Rob Hosking,

    I was stoked to finally get the chance to watch Sleeping Dogs.

    location, location, locat… • Since Dec 2010 • 250 posts Report Reply

  • Mark Graham, in reply to Ian Dalziel,

    Doesn't the Govt own Mediaworks these days? Apart from John Campbell, it certainly seems the case to me.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 215 posts Report Reply

  • Mick Rose, in reply to Rob Hosking,

    You're missing the point: I've got no reason to doubt Graeme's critique of the examples given by Gordon, and it's a useful critique, but it's also snide, pedantic and grandiose.

    Why dedicate a blog-post to this when Graeme could have communicated privately with Gordon or posted a comment directly on Gordon's original article?

    I agree with Yoza: Gordon's commentary and analysis is generally superb - this is a peculiar way to engage with that commentary.

    Since Oct 2010 • 7 posts Report Reply

  • philipmatthews, in reply to Mick Rose,

    Why dedicate a blog-post to this when Graeme could have communicated privately with Gordon or posted a comment directly on Gordon’s original article?

    I agree with Mick. Why not just put these complaints in the comments at Scoop?

    CK Stead’s ‘Smith’s Dream’ was written in the Muldoon era.

    My turn to be pedantic, I suppose. Smith's Dream was first published in 1971 and Stead has talked about it as a response to Vietnam war protests, as he wondered how a more autocratic government would crack down.

    Christchurch • Since Nov 2007 • 656 posts Report Reply

  • Graeme Edgeler, in reply to philipmatthews,

    I agree with Mick. Why not just put these complaints in the comments at Scoop?

    I would have if it was just one mistake. Stuff like that happens. It was the multiple errors on the same point that had me exercised in this case.

    Wellington, New Zealand • Since Nov 2006 • 3202 posts Report Reply

  • Rob Stowell, in reply to Rob Hosking,

    I would love to see those who don’t agree with Graeme’s post provide some on-point rebuttal

    Here :)

    Whakaraupo • Since Nov 2006 • 2090 posts Report Reply

  • Craig Ranapia, in reply to Mick Rose,

    You’re missing the point: I’ve got no reason to doubt Graeme’s critique of the examples given by Gordon, and it’s a useful critique, but it’s also snide, pedantic and grandiose.

    Fucking hell, so it’s now “snide, pedantic and grandiose” to publicly critique a journalist being well… somewhat careless on basic matters of fact? Too right: Graeme pull your fucking head in, and stop acting like journalists and politicians actually have some kind of obligation to tell the truth, the whole truth and not just the bits they find convenient.

    BTW, guys: Here's a modest proposal. Think about how incredibly dangerous it is to give "our side" a pass for playing fast and loose with the facts. If you're on the side of the angels, isn't it all the more important that you don't undermine your own credibility? This isn't the first time folks around PAS have been willing to cut Campbell slack they not only wouldn't give anyone else, but which nobody deserves.

    North Shore, Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 12370 posts Report Reply

  • Yoza, in reply to Craig Ranapia,

    I’m guessing you haven’t read Gordon Campbell’s defense of his article, to which Rob Stowell has already linked.

    Wellington • Since Oct 2007 • 12 posts Report Reply

  • Craig Ranapia, in reply to Yoza,

    I’m guessing you haven’t read Gordon Campbell’s defense of his article, to which Rob Stowell has already linked.

    You're guessing wrong. That's how the internet in the hands of grown ups work, and Gordon actually engaging with criticism (not entirely convincingly, IMO, but that's another kete of kai moana) is significantly more useful than coming onto Graeme's blog and telling him to STFU and be a good team player. When does that ever end well?

    North Shore, Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 12370 posts Report Reply

  • Lilith __, in reply to Craig Ranapia,

    telling him to STFU and be a good team player. When does that ever end well?

    Sorry Craig, but where is anybody saying that? The only one trying to close down discussion seems to be you.

    I’d like to see Graeme answer Gordon’s reply, particularly to give his response to Gordon’s main point about the erosion of democracy.

    I’m all for fisking and debate. Although I find it odd that the title of this post is a person’s name, not the actual topic. It makes the post seem like a personal attack, even if it is not.

    Dunedin • Since Jul 2010 • 3887 posts Report Reply

  • Graeme Edgeler, in reply to Lilith __,

    I’d like to see Graeme answer Gordon’s reply, particularly to give his response to Gordon’s main point about the erosion of democracy.

    I have answered Gordon’s reply as a comment to his piece.

    Although I find it odd that the title of this post is a person’s name, not the actual topic. It makes the post seem like a personal attack, even if it is not.

    As I note in my first reply, the title is a twitter joke directed at Scoop's Gordon Campbell twitter account, not at Gordon, who may not even know it exists :-)

    Wellington, New Zealand • Since Nov 2006 • 3202 posts Report Reply

  • "chris", in reply to Graeme Edgeler,

    I particularly liked this Graeme:

    Some of my favourite debates/discussions have been ones where I have ‘lost’. I don’t want my view to win, I want the better view to be my view, and that may mean recognising that the view I was arguing for was wrong. If someone changes my mind about something, I’m always a little more comforted that I (now) hold the right view. Having a view that someone hasn’t changed may just mean that I haven’t heard the right rebuttal yet.

    location, location, locat… • Since Dec 2010 • 250 posts Report Reply

  • Lilith __, in reply to Graeme Edgeler,

    I’d like to see Graeme answer Gordon’s reply, particularly to give his response to Gordon’s main point about the erosion of democracy.

    I have answered Gordon’s reply as a comment to his piece.

    Oh right, cheers.

    Dunedin • Since Jul 2010 • 3887 posts Report Reply

  • andin,

    I haven’t heard the right rebuttal yet.

    You can change your own views :-)

    raglan • Since Mar 2007 • 1881 posts Report Reply

First ←Older Page 1 2 Newer→ Last

Post your response…

Please sign in using your Public Address credentials…

Login

You may also create an account or retrieve your password.