Polity by Rob Salmond

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Polity: Key Derangement Syndrome Derangement Syndrome

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  • linger, in reply to simon g,

    Let’s call it “people derangement syndrome” – why not?

    Here’s why not:
    (i) It’s not an entirely general misanthropy: they’re mostly quite happy to support other people belonging to their own coterie.
    (ii) They’re not deranged; they’re just not empathetic enough to be fit for any job looking after the interest of the general public.

    One could call it “underclass disparagement syndrome”
    (aka beneficiary bashing).

    Tokyo • Since Apr 2007 • 1889 posts Report Reply

  • Rob Stowell, in reply to Sacha,

    But they also do a better job of digesting, framing and feeding the media than the left.

    Yes- and while some of that is definitely down to JK (the best ‘communicator’ in politics at least since Lange) the polling and comms should also get some credit. But it’s also worth noting: it’s not so hard to look good when your chief opponent keeps shooting themselves in the jiǎoyāzi .
    (rant edited for brevity: Labour supporter on downward spiral of disappointment sighs lengthily)

    Whakaraupo • Since Nov 2006 • 2091 posts Report Reply

  • John Palethorpe, in reply to Matthew Hooton,

    Matthew, I'd agree with that to a certain extent. Key is a phenomenon and the National party certainly have the air of a group of people who only occasionally realise how lucky they are to have him up front for them.

    On the communications and management side, it's true they foul up (more often as they get later into this term it seems) but they're also adept at moving the issue on when they need to, rather than getting mired in failures and defeats. That's not just a Key trait - watching a lot of their Ministers, even when on the back foot, retain a certain confidence and surety of footing - they're relatively disciplined when it comes to sticking to the bloody line when the bloody line is given to them.

    There's no 'genius' comms department at work here, but my remark about being out thought, out manouevered and out messaged isn't to confer genius upon National's setup (they're relatively ordinary if well disciplined when it comes to presentation) but to highlight how absolutely sodding awful the Opposition's approach tends to be at times.

    It's not hard to look good when your opponents are that bad.

    Auckland • Since May 2015 • 83 posts Report Reply

  • Rich of Observationz,

    You see the problem when you have a "partisan" column. All the Tory trolls come out of the woodwork and play with each other.

    Boring, boring boring...

    Back in Wellington • Since Nov 2006 • 5550 posts Report Reply

  • John Palethorpe, in reply to Rich of Observationz,

    I may add Tory troll to my CV. I've never been called one of those before.

    Auckland • Since May 2015 • 83 posts Report Reply

  • Russell Brown, in reply to Rich of Observationz,

    You see the problem when you have a “partisan” column. All the Tory trolls come out of the woodwork and play with each other.

    Boring, boring boring…

    Ha ha. You might want to think about your response there.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 22756 posts Report Reply

  • Russell Brown, in reply to Matthew Hooton,

    and now the Vic for Mayor campaign being run by Crosby Texter’s Auckland office.

    For real, or is that a joke I'm missing?

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 22756 posts Report Reply

  • Rich of Observationz, in reply to Russell Brown,

    You know, just providing feedback. If you feel there's a demand for that sort of thing, there probably is. I'll expect Redbaiter, Tinakori and all that lot to be along shortly.

    Back in Wellington • Since Nov 2006 • 5550 posts Report Reply

  • linger, in reply to Rich of Observationz,

    In the sense that, as with BDS, KDS or IBS, “troll” can be an easy reflexive, refluxive, unreflecting smear.

    Tokyo • Since Apr 2007 • 1889 posts Report Reply

  • Matthew Hooton, in reply to Russell Brown,

    For real. Jo de Joux is on the payroll. Her firm, Hannifin de Joux, is CT's local arm. See http://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/2015/02/hannifin_de_joux_partners_with_crosby_textor.html

    Auckland • Since Aug 2007 • 194 posts Report Reply

  • John Palethorpe, in reply to Matthew Hooton,

    That's Jo de Joux, partner of Phil de Joux - former Deputy Chief of Staff to the PM, isn't it?

    Auckland • Since May 2015 • 83 posts Report Reply

  • Matthew Hooton, in reply to John Palethorpe,

    Yes. She also led the Northland by-election campaign for National.

    Auckland • Since Aug 2007 • 194 posts Report Reply

  • John Palethorpe, in reply to Matthew Hooton,

    A sequence of unalloyed delight then.

    Auckland • Since May 2015 • 83 posts Report Reply

  • Northshoreguynz,

    Can't we say, for the first time; "National started it" with their HDS at the height of the Helen era. Accusations of being a lesbian, not fit to run the country because she didn't have kids etc.etc.
    As you sow, so shall you reap.

    New Zealand • Since Aug 2014 • 16 posts Report Reply

  • linger, in reply to Northshoreguynz,

    Nah. That's the "tu quoque" fallacy ("But you do it too!" "You did it first!"). Sinking to the same childish level only rewards that behaviour. We face a hard enough struggle getting productive political discussion as it is.

    Tokyo • Since Apr 2007 • 1889 posts Report Reply

  • Russell Brown, in reply to linger,

    True. But it does recall the memory of how weird and vile that whole thing got.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 22756 posts Report Reply

  • Andrew C, in reply to Kiwiiano,

    And how did it manage to get a Norwegian maple leaf on it rather than a Canadian ?

    From wiki:

    and it bears a stylized red maple leaf at its centre

    and

    The number of points on the leaf has no special significance;the number and arrangement of the points were chosen after wind tunnel tests showed the current design to be the least blurry of the various designs when tested under high wind conditions.

    Auckland • Since May 2008 • 168 posts Report Reply

  • Andrew Robertson,

    I've come to this discussion rather late sorry, but just want to add that (to my knowledge) none of the flag polls have actually been designed to predict the referendum result.

    They've been measuring public support for each option, certainly.

    If I'd been asked to predict the referendum result using the poll, I would have done a few things differently.

    There. Now I've covered myself :)

    Wellington • Since Apr 2014 • 65 posts Report Reply

  • Mr Mark, in reply to Andrew Robertson,

    What I find quite interesting about the two latest UMR Research Polls is that:

    (1) Like other recent polls on the flag referendum (including your own One News Colmar Brunton ), they find that younger voters are a little more opposed to change than the older cohort.

    (2) They find younger voters (as in General Elections) are less likely to say they will vote in the Second Referendum, while older voters are most likely to.

    And yet
    (3) They also find that, among those most likely to vote (irrespective of age - just likely voters in general), the current flag's margin actually increases over the Lockwood alternative.

    Suggesting, perhaps, that either the minority of older New Zealanders unlikely to vote in the Referendum are disproportionately Lockwood Design supporters or those younger New Zealanders who say they will probably or certainly vote disproportionately favour the current ensign (meaning: even more so than their age-group as a whole).

    Wellington • Since Dec 2009 • 128 posts Report Reply

  • Andrew Robertson,

    Oh I stand corrected. It sounds like UMR have designed a poll that might predict the referendum result.

    Wellington • Since Apr 2014 • 65 posts Report Reply

  • Tom Semmens, in reply to Richard Mayes,

    How cynical is it though?
    The news media were interviewing people at the TPPA protest in Akl who couldn’t actually say what the TPPA was or why they were against it.
    But somehow they “knew” it had something to do with the rich getting richer and John Key was behind it all, and John Key’s let us down, and John Key John Key John Key…

    “Deranged” seems about right!

    What leaps out at me from this piece of rubbish is how perfectly it fits the whole meta of so-called Key Derangement Syndrome. The aim is to keep the debate focussed entirely on delegitimising the messenger so as to avoid discussing the message. The opponents of the TPPA? Talk about how ignorant they are. That avoids engaging on the issues their representatives want to discuss. Critics of John Key? Accuse them of having a mental health syndrome, rather than have a proper discussion of Keys rather shabby record of honesty.

    As a meta, it is perfectly made for a degraded and decadent media. It is easier and cheaper and rastes better to have Hoskings sneer at the PMs enemies as morons or obsessives than confront the issues.

    The media here in Spain is such a breath of fresh air. The other night on the news a rumpled, boffin like political scientist spent ten minutes(!!!!!!!!!!) going through the latest state of play in the talks to form a government, and that was followed later by a panel discussion. Spanish voters may be cynical and disillusioned, but unlike NZ voters, they are not ignorant of the issues.

    Sevilla, Espana • Since Nov 2006 • 2213 posts Report Reply

  • Tom Semmens,

    One other thing about living in a country old fashioned enough to have a proper news media. It opens your eyes to how really, really, really, really, really awful our media has become and how complete the collapse of real journalism is in NZ. The situation isn’t juyst desperately bad, it is worse than you now can all possibly imagine, because it doesn’t take long to forget what decent news and analysis actually looked like and assume the Bullshit being dished up to the public in NZ is still journalism.

    My reactions to reading the MSM in NZ from here nowadays range between disgust, incredulity and anger.

    Sevilla, Espana • Since Nov 2006 • 2213 posts Report Reply

  • Ian Dalziel, in reply to Tom Semmens,

    One other thing about living in a country old fashioned enough to have a proper news media. It opens your eyes to how really, really, really, really, really awful our media has become and how complete the collapse of real journalism is in NZ.

    I noticed that in France and Barcelona too, people analysing things, talking, not that I could understand much of it (hopefully it wasn't the equivalent of Euro-Fox) - but great to see it actually happening - is it a critical mass of population thing?

    PS: Which Hemingway book are you off to next?

    Christchurch • Since Dec 2006 • 7892 posts Report Reply

  • Rob Stowell, in reply to Ian Dalziel,

    is it a critical mass of population thing?

    I think it's more a critical mass of neo-liberal hegemony thing :)

    Whakaraupo • Since Nov 2006 • 2091 posts Report Reply

  • Alfie, in reply to Ian Dalziel,

    is it a critical mass of population thing?

    I don't think so Ian. I may have mentioned this before but Kim Hill had a great interview last year with Piv Bernth, head of drama for Danish TV. They have a population of 5.5m and each household pays a broadcasting fee of around $NZ400pa. For that they get eight TV channels and eight radio stations -- all commercial free.

    One comment from Ms Bernth stood out to me, and I paraphrase... "We have a lot of programmes analysing the news". That level of public scrutiny has all but disappeared from NZ media.

    I have a good friend from Poland who's worried about events in her country. On the back of the migrant crisis the extreme right Law and Justice party took over the government late last year. The first thing they did, after replacing the juduciary with their own people, was to sack all of the broadcasting heads. Controlling the media with no viable alternative voice gives you a direct line to people's minds.

    Call me a conspiracist, but I reckon the same thing has happened here. Sure it took a few years to implement, and it was a good deal more subtle than the Polish example. But apart from RNZ, almost all of our media is extremely "government-friendly" nowadays.

    Whether you call it dumbing down or go with John Key's "people prefer entertainment" line, the end result is a submissive population.

    I'd like to think there is still a taste for public service broadcasting in NZ. Unfortunately it's no longer offered as an option.

    Dunedin • Since May 2014 • 1386 posts Report Reply

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