Up Front by Emma Hart

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Up Front: A Word in Your Ear

172 Responses

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  • Steve Barnes,

    "He's not an artist, he's just one of those little cunts that draws skulls."

    Like a BP Graphics Department?.

    Peria • Since Dec 2006 • 5521 posts Report Reply

  • 3410,

    It's Language, Bro

    Indeed it is. The Labour party would do well to consider that. Currently, they're consistently on the back foot, largely, IMO, because they allow the other guys to frame the discussion.

    Auckland • Since Jan 2007 • 2618 posts Report Reply

  • andin,

    But we can try to be more aware of the problems of the inarticulate, more aware of our privilege, and more patient with their pathetic witterings.

    Fuck that! Whoops was that the wrong thing to say.
    Umm .....it's been tried and it failed. All it does is motivate a plethora of the inarticulate to form charitable trusts or churchs (see they may be tongue-tied, but they're interfering & avaricious) such as SST and those other thick fuckers starts with D, and in the United States of Oil .........Evangelicals and Teabaggers.

    Oh were you being wry again, I can never tell with you and the good Doctor.
    In which case nevermind.

    raglan • Since Mar 2007 • 1882 posts Report Reply

  • Steve Barnes,

    Professors, lost souls with great oratory power?Synchronousity? Interesting comments.

    Peria • Since Dec 2006 • 5521 posts Report Reply

  • Lucy Stewart,

    I found that a utility company we've been having difficulties with suggests a slightly different wording. If you call them, and the person answering the call doesn't sort things out, you say, "I'd like to escalate this call" and they pass you further up the tree.

    The best advice I have received is to ask whoever you're dealing with what they would do in your situation. It's not a guaranteed success, but it can draw out surprisingly useful tips.

    Wellington • Since Nov 2006 • 2105 posts Report Reply

  • giovanni tiso,

    It's Language, Bro

    Indeed it is. The Labour party would do well to consider that. Currently, they're consistently on the back foot, largely, IMO, because they allow the other guys to frame the discussion.

    Or because when they try to frame it, they bungle it.The Axe the Tax campaign was stupid on a variety of levels, not the least of which was the language: Labour never had in fact any intention to "axe" any "tax".

    Wellington • Since Jun 2007 • 7473 posts Report Reply

  • 3410,

    Yeah; that's just what I was thinking of.

    Auckland • Since Jan 2007 • 2618 posts Report Reply

  • Sacha,

    John Armstrong may diss the Greens (surprise) but at least they are consistently pushing progressive framing like inequality.

    However, their message that National is quite deliberately widening the gap must avoid naive phrases like "failing to address inequality" that misunderstand the govt's motivations and let them off the hook - but are eagerly lapped up by journos and editors.

    Ak • Since May 2008 • 19688 posts Report Reply

  • Jackie Clark,

    And then there's people who don't talk alot. I have found talking alot to be somewhat of a disadvantage because when you're in a situation where verbal contributions are expected - and teachers have alot of these courses, and workshops, and meetings - there are always people, who invited to speak, choose not to. So those of us who have something to contribute do so, and there is always someone leading the group who says something along the lines of "yes, well, let's hear from someone else". Well, yes, let's. Except the other fuckers in the room are silent. My belief is that if you are a grownup and you have something to say, then say it. Do not act as if not talking alot is a virtue, because it is not. Sometimes still waters run deep, sometimes they're just still. Drives me mad. Can you tell?

    Mt Eden, Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 3136 posts Report Reply

  • Sacha,

    Same. In any group of people (including online) many are happy not to say anything or to wait until later to chip in. Facilitators who confuse groups with therapy sessions are notorious for not grasping this.

    Ak • Since May 2008 • 19688 posts Report Reply

  • Yamis,

    I agree to a point but then there's often a physical aspect to winning arguments as well, or volume, or quota of swear words (I get told off for using up my quota too quickly but then I'm one of those exasperated arguers who is convinced they are right and flabbergasted that anybody could possibly not agree immediately).

    A great example of how being articulate can get you places is Barack Obama.

    But then look at the bloke who filled that job for the 8 years before him, not the worlds greatest speaker and that was with years of practice and other people handing him what to say.

    Since Nov 2006 • 903 posts Report Reply

  • Sacha,

    Cheney was more than articulate enough to make up for his sockpuppet

    Ak • Since May 2008 • 19688 posts Report Reply

  • Yamis,

    My point (I think I had one.... once), though is that Bush himself was elected President. Whether he became something that people put their hands up later is another matter as the public wouldn't have known that at the time.

    Obama most certainly won the job because of his articulationary skills.

    Since Nov 2006 • 903 posts Report Reply

  • Sacha,

    It's a contrast, for sure

    Ak • Since May 2008 • 19688 posts Report Reply

  • Joe Wylie,

    Do not act as if not talking alot is a virtue, because it is not.

    It's something of an NZ tradition, particularly with blokes. I think it was Peter Wells who once said that in certain quarters it's seen as something of a triumph to get a sentence out without appearing to open your mouth. During the making of Footrot Flats, the Movie, Murray Ball sent a directive to the (mostly Australian) animators telling them that the standard cartoon lip-synch employed for the Wal character wasn't working - an NZ cocky would think it "uncool" to ever open his mouth that wide.

    Adolescent girls are different. By stretching vowels, along with rising and falling tones, they're able to squeeze at least four syllables into a word like gross.

    On a visit to NZ during the Muldoon era, former Whitlam Minister Jim Cairns saw similarities between NZ and Queensland attitudes. Being repressed people who were afraid to say what they really felt, they elected grotesque politicians who'd give voice to their twisted resentments.

    flat earth • Since Jan 2007 • 4591 posts Report Reply

  • Linda,

    And then there's people who don't talk alot.

    Or you could morph into Sara Palin - if you do.

    [redacted larger post] - 'cos it was inarticulate - but would still prefer to look more like Sara Palin, than sound like her.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 14 posts Report Reply

  • Isabel Hitchings,

    The best advice I have received is to ask whoever you're dealing with what they would do in your situation. It's not a guaranteed success, but it can draw out surprisingly useful tips.

    Except when the doctor then says "I'd have refused the test in the first place" which is just annoying.

    Christchurch • Since Jul 2007 • 719 posts Report Reply

  • Islander,

    O Isabel Hitchings, that brings up the whole matter of talking to people who have cant/group/insider/specialist/lingos and- because they use them all the time - assume everyone else does too...

    I have a fairly good grasp of the english language but was initially stumped, sometime mid-last year, by a lovely med person using the word lacunae: I knew it's meaning (you get lacunae in parchments) but I didnt understand what it had to do with my brain...

    thank goodness I had a wonderful whanau GP interpreter!
    (And the word should've been lacuna-)

    Big O, Mahitahi, Te Wahi … • Since Feb 2007 • 5643 posts Report Reply

  • Isabel Hitchings,

    Islander - the ability to translate specialist jargon for the lay-person without dumbing it down is rare and precious indeed.

    Christchurch • Since Jul 2007 • 719 posts Report Reply

  • Islander,

    Isabel , indeed- and I rather think - necessarily from time & other constraints - not high on the list of most specialist jargon-users...

    Big O, Mahitahi, Te Wahi … • Since Feb 2007 • 5643 posts Report Reply

  • Sacha,

    translate specialist jargon for the lay-person

    And those who are often best-placed to do that are not the time-starved specialists, but others with an educational or communications bent and enough subject knowledge not to get it wrong.

    Ak • Since May 2008 • 19688 posts Report Reply

  • Islander,

    which people, I think Isabel & Sacha would agree, are *extremely* thin on the ground-

    I would love to be able to set up some kind of
    -?interpretation system?
    where people with my s.i.l GP's degree of knowledge
    and various medical specialists' especial word useage
    and my kind of knowledge of english (put other language of choice herein) can make life - not to mention diagnoses!- a bit easier...

    And, of course, that brings in people who can also help with cultural matters...

    Big O, Mahitahi, Te Wahi … • Since Feb 2007 • 5643 posts Report Reply

  • Sacha,

    Funny you should say that...

    Ak • Since May 2008 • 19688 posts Report Reply

  • Islander,

    There are some?
    In my tribal district, there are none with that skillset (or availabliity) - you got 'em Sach' - come south-please!

    Big O, Mahitahi, Te Wahi … • Since Feb 2007 • 5643 posts Report Reply

  • Sacha,

    Working on something relevant - more detail later in year

    Ak • Since May 2008 • 19688 posts Report Reply

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