"Smokescreen," I scream

9:22 Jun 24, 2009 67

Can somebody take this up for me?

Can the Minister for Corrections explain why the previous prisoner forecast, included in the Briefing to the Incoming Minister in November 2008, required 275 new prison beds per year, while the new forecast projects a requirement for 555 new prison beds per year?*

* (5000 beds required by 2018 = 555 new beds per year; original forecast was 2200 beds required by 2016 = 275 new beds per year.)

Was it because somebody - not naming any names - made some iddybiddy policy changes?

Drop me a line if you're gonna to ask this.

It's the same bloody pattern again. Focus on the "controversial" stuff, like shipping containers and double bunking, and making it sound as though National has a very new approach to solving an old problem that they are carrying from Labour.

Nevermind that the double bunking is just using "supplementary beds", which is not new or novel - they are following the plan they inherited from Labour down to the letter.

Here. Page 23. The line goes into "supplementary beds" territory. It means that "hey, we're probably going to have to double bunk by mid-2010".

And now, Key and Collins are making the hard calls... by telling us that we're probably going to have to double bunk by mid-2010.

The tough act is a smokescreen for the *actual* news, that the number of new beds required are expected to double.

67 responses to this post

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Craig Ranapia, 09:47 Jun 24, 2009

Here's my question:
With Labour and National competing to see who could beat their chests the hardest, and exude the most testosterone...
what the flaming fuck were you people expecting?

North Shore, Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 12370 posts Report
giovanni tiso, 09:59 Jun 24, 2009

Yes, the last couple of elections have been a race for who could be the toriest, that's hard to dispute. Still, a little more of an inward gaze on why your party and your ideology insist that so many of us should be incarcerated, wouldn't hurt, Craig. "You people" seems to be your default setting, as if you weren't implicated in any of this.

Wellington • Since Jun 2007 • 7473 posts Report
Craig Ranapia, 10:10 Jun 24, 2009

"You people" seems to be your default setting, as if you weren't implicated in any of this.
Since I got off my arse and bothered to vote, I guess I'm totally "implicated". But, not for the first time, I do find it less than useful to be assimilated into some bizarre Borg Collective. Much as it wounds my ego to admit, I'm not on the mailing list for those right-wing and homosexual agendas I hear so much about. Nor do I have a standing invite to sit in on Cabinet and do my best Heather Simpson impersonation whenever I happen to be in Wellywood.
Now, I'd like some meditation on why the overwhelming majority of voters went for two parties in a Laura Norder butch-off, but seem so fastidiously horrified at the (to me) blindingly obvious outcome.

North Shore, Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 12370 posts Report
Gareth Ward, 10:11 Jun 24, 2009

But Craig it's the hiding of that testosterone that's so frustrating here. If you wanna be "tough on crime" then own up to it. If you wanna build affordable prison cells because your sentencing policies are putting more people inside for longer then own up to it.
This need to hide it behind spin du jour is what flaming fucks me off. (And yes, it's Government. Sure. But this is another level up. And I still have the right to complain to the interwebs about it :> )

Auckland, NZ • Since Mar 2007 • 1727 posts Report
giovanni tiso, 10:13 Jun 24, 2009

All the same, it's your party in bed that got between the sheets with Act and Mr Garrett, not mine. Not sure that casting aspersion everywhere else, as if everybody but Craig was in fact part of a Borg collective, is a tremendously honest way to go.

Wellington • Since Jun 2007 • 7473 posts Report
Sacha, 10:31 Jun 24, 2009

I agree with Craig that voters are unlikely to be surprised by the chest beating over crime, and given his previous form Goff was never going to do much different.
However, it strikes me as the opposite of "ambitious" to build more prisons and hire more cops rather than do what's needed to give all New Zealanders more reason for a constructive present and a hopeful future.
Actually doing something about training and jobs now would be a start, rather than trotting out the same lies about "thousands" in motorway construction. It is a drop in the bucket, one of the least job-intensive industries and not happening for some years anyway.
The local roadworks I'm noticing everywhere now are from the previous government's spending, before Steven Joyce and co decided to divert it into big national highway-building projects which employ even fewer people per dollar. Funding those projects by cutting road maintenance budgets hardly seems ambitious either. Anyone who wants to see the long term results needs to look no further than Auckland's decrepid footpaths and sewers.
The ignorant and deceptive spin about those fundamental choices pisses me off. I'm not holding Craig accountable for any of that just because he's one of the only people here who are openly aligned with National. That's a hard enough cross to bear on it's own, surely. :)

Ak • Since May 2008 • 19745 posts Report
Sacha, 10:33 Jun 24, 2009

between the sheets with Act and Mr Garrett
By the water cooler, you mean?
Hey, the space after italics problem is fixed. Cheers to the cactus elves.

Ak • Since May 2008 • 19745 posts Report
giovanni tiso, 10:34 Jun 24, 2009

Just to be clear, I'm not begrduging Craig that fact that he's a Tory. I just wished he stopped blaming the rest of us for putting the tories in charge sometimes.

Wellington • Since Jun 2007 • 7473 posts Report
Sacha, 10:42 Jun 24, 2009

blaming the rest of us for putting the tories in charge
Not resisting their installation better seems a fair charge. Democracy and all that.

Ak • Since May 2008 • 19745 posts Report
Craig Ranapia, 10:45 Jun 24, 2009

Just to be clear, I'm not begrduging Craig that fact that he's a Tory. I just wished he stopped blaming the rest of us for putting the tories in charge sometimes.
Um what? I just find it rather amusing that people are so shocked at the notion that courting Laura Norder before the election will have consequences afterwards -- and some of those might not be pretty. As I said: What the frak was anyone really expecting?

North Shore, Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 12370 posts Report
giovanni tiso, 10:45 Jun 24, 2009

Not resisting their installation better seems a fair charge.
Yeah, maybe from a members of the workers' party. Not from a freaking Tory!

Wellington • Since Jun 2007 • 7473 posts Report
Steve Barnes, 11:08 Jun 24, 2009

Well, at least John Key is trying to do something about the unemployment figures
"We've got one of the lowest levels of unemployment. Now, we're working to combat that."
Yes, we won't be beaten by those damned foreigners.
But now you've lost your job you will have the opportunity to buy your own state house Does anyone else hear the thundering hooves of market rents approaching?
Meanwhile Family Fist (sic) believes Forcing your kid to play rugby is good parenting.
Sheesh, and its only Wednesday.

Peria • Since Dec 2006 • 5521 posts Report
Ian Dalziel, 11:20 Jun 24, 2009

Smoke and mirrors...
Not so much Caucusobfuscation as Double Bunkum
I guess they'll be "topping-and-tailing" by 2010 then...
I agree with Sacha that more needs to be done to restore hope and self esteem in the ccommunity.
Why would you cut night classes and special needs schools (like Aorangi Primary in Chch) just to save money - the psychic equivalent of boring holes in the lifeboats...
The country needs a heart and a brain, with less Testosterone and more Serotonin & Dopamine... 8- )
yrs
Elric The Eternal Optimist
Gottfried Leibniz Appreciation Society

Christchurch • Since Dec 2006 • 7953 posts Report
Kumara Republic, 11:28 Jun 24, 2009

Um what? I just find it rather amusing that people are so shocked at the notion that courting Laura Norder before the election will have consequences afterwards -- and some of those might not be pretty. As I said: What the frak was anyone really expecting?
It all comes as no surprise to me. But am I not the only one to suspect that it could come to something like this, or even this?
And as I mentioned in another thread, there'll be a nationwide shortage of ambulances because they've all been deployed to the bottom of Norder Cliff.

The southernmost capital … • Since Nov 2006 • 5446 posts Report
Steve Barnes, 11:35 Jun 24, 2009

the psychic equivalent of boring holes in the lifeboats...
Yes Ian. We demand interesting holes.

Peria • Since Dec 2006 • 5521 posts Report
Joe Wylie, 11:43 Jun 24, 2009

Why would you cut night classes and special needs schools (like Aorangi Primary in Chch) just to save money - the psychic equivalent of boring holes in the lifeboats...
Ah, but the responsibility's yours Ian. While you personally might not have actively whored after Laura Norder, like all of us who are not privileged to be the One True Fanboy, you bear the collective stain. Kind of like original sin. When they come for your firstborn there's nothing for it but to man up and take it for the team.
Though meditation might just help.

flat earth • Since Jan 2007 • 4593 posts Report
Russell Brown, 11:54 Jun 24, 2009

Meanwhile Family Fist (sic) believes Forcing your kid to play rugby is good parenting.
Can FF find a put-upon "good parent" who isn't a textbook example of a man with anger problems knocking his kids around?
To be fair to the rugby dad, he pled guilty and went on an anger management course. He appears to be shouldering the responsibility that McCroskie is desperate to direct anywhere else.
I'm just waiting for one of the usual suspects to implicitly blame the child. Or did I miss that already?

Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 22850 posts Report
Russell Brown, 11:55 Jun 24, 2009

Though meditation might just help.
I have found recently that medication is better.

Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 22850 posts Report
Craig Ranapia, 12:16 Jun 24, 2009

I have found recently that medication is better.
And so it is when you're getting the real good shit legally. :)
Ah, but the responsibility's yours Ian. While you personally might not have actively whored after Laura Norder, like all of us who are not privileged to be the One True Fanboy, you bear the collective stain.
*sigh* Well, like it or not vote catchers come with price tags and unpleasant realities attached. Sorry about that, but there you go and here we are.

North Shore, Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 12370 posts Report
Lucy Stewart, 12:24 Jun 24, 2009

*sigh* Well, like it or not vote catchers come with price tags and unpleasant realities attached. Sorry about that, but there you go and here we are.
Indeed. And when you find that mystical third major party which gets every policy exactly right, I will be right there.

Wellington • Since Nov 2006 • 2105 posts Report
Graeme Edgeler, 12:25 Jun 24, 2009

Can FF find a put-upon "good parent" who isn't a textbook example of a man with anger problems knocking his kids around?
Family First has a list of about 30 cases that they claim show the law isn't working well. Some may fall within your parameters.

Wellington, New Zealand • Since Nov 2006 • 3215 posts Report
Steve Barnes, 12:27 Jun 24, 2009

Can FF find a put-upon "good parent" who isn't a textbook example of a man with anger problems knocking his kids around?
I doubt it. But let's be fair here, bringing up kids is not all Disney fantasy "family" stuff. There are frustrations, demands and downright devilry. We are the grown ups, we shouldn't resort to the same tactics as children, we shouldn't have temper tantrums, sarcasm works wonders but you have to be clever. Something that the Fist brigade can't aspire to.

Peria • Since Dec 2006 • 5521 posts Report
Lyndon Hood, 13:16 Jun 24, 2009

Actually, it is a national disgrace for this country to have the second highest rate of incarceration after the United States.
Judith wept.

Wellington • Since Nov 2006 • 1115 posts Report
Kyle Matthews, 13:23 Jun 24, 2009

Can FF find a put-upon "good parent" who isn't a textbook example of a man with anger problems knocking his kids around?
They're not very good at choosing their test cases are they? They've been compiling 'victim parents' for adverts during the referendum. No doubt we'll find out all sorts of interesting things about them as well.

Since Nov 2006 • 6243 posts Report
Kyle Matthews, 13:26 Jun 24, 2009

From Lyndon's link:
Justice sector forecasts point to an extra 5,000 prison beds being required by 2018. Clearly, we will also have to build a new prison
Heh. Try ten new prisons.

Since Nov 2006 • 6243 posts Report