Polity by Rob Salmond

Read Post

Polity: Key Derangement Syndrome Derangement Syndrome

106 Responses

First ←Older Page 1 2 3 4 5 Newer→ Last

  • bob daktari,

    the infantile games those with too much time and too close to power play - as a mere member of the public it gets tiring to be constantly insulted by those who seek my favour from both sides of the alleged left/right divide

    can we talk policy?

    auckland • Since Dec 2006 • 538 posts Report Reply

  • Rob Salmond,

    Yes, bob, we can talk policy. On the assumption you mean policy around the flag, I voted for the current flag because I think that increases the chance we have a really great, new flag in the next 20 years. In my opinion, the Lockwood design is not a "really great, new flag."

    Wellington • Since Jun 2015 • 102 posts Report Reply

  • bob daktari, in reply to Rob Salmond,

    cheers - I'm all flagged out to be honest, never has a process delivered so little imo.

    I care less about the final design as the process - one of the best chances in a long time for us as a nation to discuss who we think we are was at best mangled and and... I am saddened and angry at the lost opportunity

    Now I want to know about Labour policy - how the party has and is changing and why I should care about them, point scoring against hooten seems shallow and hollow in this context, especially as thats his desire

    auckland • Since Dec 2006 • 538 posts Report Reply

  • Rob Salmond,

    @Bob: You may have seen Labour has a substantial new policy on post-school education (three years' fee-free training), which is part of its response to the challenges of the rapidly changing workplace. There will be much more policy coming in this area. Labour has also taken a strong stand in favour of melanoma patients currently dying while the government dithers. We're stronger advocates than the government for New Zealanders living in Australia, whether they're living in offshore detention centres without good reason or living in cities and suburbs without proper rights. We're the only party with meaningful solutions (ie. build some homes!) to the rampant house price inflation, especially in Auckland. And there's plenty more to come.

    I will admit I enjoy a little point-scoring against Matthew and others of his ilk from time to time. But the core of our work is to make this country a better place for all who live in it.

    Wellington • Since Jun 2015 • 102 posts Report Reply

  • bob daktari, in reply to Rob Salmond,

    I appreciate your point scoring honesty... and replies

    Big fan of the three years free training action, to put it mildly, I enjoyed free tertiary education and want (demand and expect) others to have similar opportunities, also a tad selfishly as we have two high schoolers in our household, both who want to go to uni

    Or to save time, I follow the policies Labour are offering up, keen to see more talk about those and many others from Labour and others, also very interested to see more from Labour and Greens on both parties working together way more closely and hopefully the Maori Party and Mana too - i.e. a combined effort working for the benefit of us all :)

    auckland • Since Dec 2006 • 538 posts Report Reply

  • Carol Stewart, in reply to Rob Salmond,

    Labour has also taken a strong stand in favour of melanoma patients currently dying while the government dithers.

    What do you mean by this, Rob? Increasing funding for Pharmac, or trying to influence Pharmac's decision making processes?

    Wellington • Since Jul 2008 • 822 posts Report Reply

  • Rich of Observationz,

    Labour has also taken a strong stand in favour of melanoma patients currently dying while the government dithers

    That’s one way of putting it. You could also argue that Labour has decided to throw money at a drug multinational (presumably) over other health priorities such as GP availability or diseases of poverty? I don’t hear that that there will be a general increase in health spending funded by maybe a tax rise or cuts to the oppressive sector.

    We’re the only party with meaningful solutions (ie. build some homes!) to [the] rampant house price inflation

    How does building houses help when the fundamental problem is that buying houses and land on margin is seen as a no-lose bet? – the more houses get built, the more money gets sucked in to driving the price up. It’s a bubble, not a market.

    Back in Wellington • Since Nov 2006 • 5550 posts Report Reply

  • Rob Stowell, in reply to Rob Salmond,

    Labour has also taken a strong stand in favour of melanoma patients currently dying while the government dithers.

    Which sounds great (and I’m supportive) but it could be re-phrased as taking a strong stance on paying outrageous sums to drug companies for the life of their (soon to be extended) monopolies on IP.
    While we have the current model where corporates fund research in return for monopolies, we’re going to see a lot more (potentially great new, but also quite possibly over-hyped, re-packaged with a minor variation to extend the patent) drugs come on the market – at rates most people will never afford.
    It’s a flawed model, and the TPP will entrench it and make it significantly worse. Some ideas around how medical research could be publicly funded in NZ and worldwide might be worth exploring. Or in the short-term, giving PHARMAC a stronger hand in negotiating?
    Ragging on Pharmac is a short-term dead-end.
    ETA: snap Mr Observationz :)

    Whakaraupo • Since Nov 2006 • 2091 posts Report Reply

  • Richard Mayes,

    This isn't a new thing devised at ducking for cover over the unpopularity of the flag referendum!

    We on the right have been observing "Key Derangement Syndrome" for years, and have been calling it by that name for almost as many years.

    It started in 2008 when we noticed Labour Party President Mike Williams attempted to smear Key as a fraudster, and even flew to Melbourne in a (failed!) attempt to dig up evidence to support the smear.

    Wellington • Since Dec 2007 • 6 posts Report Reply

  • John Palethorpe,

    Repeating someone's negative comment about you in full and then saying something negative about them seems like a bright, adventurous tactic for a better future.

    Auckland • Since May 2015 • 83 posts Report Reply

  • Alex Coleman,

    'We on the right have been observing "Key Derangement Syndrome" for years, and have been calling it by that name for almost as many years"

    Yeah, like much of the NZ online right's lines you lifted it straight from the GOP. Just be careful you don't trump yourselves. :)

    Wellington • Since Nov 2006 • 247 posts Report Reply

  • mpledger,

    So if someone says John Key is ridiculous does that mean they have KDS.

    It must be really infectious then because it's spread to New York and infected John Oliver.

    Since Oct 2012 • 97 posts Report Reply

  • Richard Mayes, in reply to Alex Coleman,

    '...lifted it straight from the GOP'

    Did we? News to me...

    Wellington • Since Dec 2007 • 6 posts Report Reply

  • linger, in reply to Richard Mayes,

    The reference is to Bush derangement syndrome (coined 2003).

    Tokyo • Since Apr 2007 • 1890 posts Report Reply

  • Moz, in reply to Rob Salmond,

    Labour has also taken a strong stand in favour of melanoma patients currently dying while the government dithers. We're stronger advocates than the government for New Zealanders living in Australia

    Your phrasing seems designed to encourage selective quoting, and reads unusually to me. "Labour has also taken a strong stand in favour of melanoma patients currently dying". Really? I didn't think that was even on the policy agenda (although it is a good idea, the survival rate is abysmal regardless of how much is spent on treatment).

    Sydney, West Island • Since Nov 2006 • 1198 posts Report Reply

  • Euan Mason,

    I agree, Rob. This could have been handled so much better. See http://thespinoff.co.nz/03-03-2016/a-designers-last-lament-for-this-whole-sorry-flag-fiasco/

    It's not all about Key, no matter how much he and Hooton might want it to be. It is, however, slightly sad that a Prime Minister could see a flag change as his big legacy.

    Canterbury • Since Jul 2008 • 259 posts Report Reply

  • Alfie, in reply to Richard Mayes,

    ‘…lifted it straight from the GOP’

    Did we? News to me…

    The term was first coined by a neoconservatist back in 2003. Which suggests it was hardly original five years later.

    Dunedin • Since May 2014 • 1388 posts Report Reply

  • linger, in reply to Alfie,

    And in both cases, the term is used as a pre-emptive smear of any and all opposition: it is a rhetorical device that projects the user’s extreme partisanship onto their target and indicates bad-faith argument. (Stripping away the psychobabble, it's just another way of calling your opponent crazy.)

    Tokyo • Since Apr 2007 • 1890 posts Report Reply

  • Ian Dalziel, in reply to Richard Mayes,

    lethe is more...

    Did we? News to me…

    What brand of bottled water were you 'Dexters' quaffing back then?
    Wasn't from some subterranean Greek river was it?
    Or maybe they just watered the Kool-aid down with it...
    he said 'Sinisterly'...
    :- )

    Christchurch • Since Dec 2006 • 7892 posts Report Reply

  • Kiwiiano,

    I, too, am hoping for another go at selecting the flag in a few years. But it raises the question as to a fair process, which the latest effort wasn't. How did the Canadian flag get selected. And how did it manage to get a Norwegian maple leaf on it rather than a Canadian ?

    ChCh • Since Nov 2006 • 46 posts Report Reply

  • simon g, in reply to linger,

    The reference is to Bush derangement syndrome (coined 2003).

    Yes, that's the most irritating thing about the term. Not that the Right use it (breaking news - "politicians attack opponents, with name-calling") but that its origins are ignored. It's not original, it's not clever, it's as tired as "PC Brigade", and used in the same unimaginative way, as a substitute for thought. It's even taken seriously by people like Bryce Edwards in the Herald, who should know better. Or at least, should know how to Google.

    Bush Derangement Syndrome. Obama Derangement Syndrome. Even Trump Derangement Syndrome is now a thing (what other possible reason could his critics have?). Yawn.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 1324 posts Report Reply

  • Clint Fern,

    Rob you say "And the process was a dog at every turn"

    Are you suggesting that the process should be similar to countries like Canada, South Africa, Sri Lanka, India etc where the change was decided by parliament or by a government appointed committee?

    I don't vote for Key but at least the current process has involved people voting.

    Nelson • Since Jul 2010 • 64 posts Report Reply

  • Richard Mayes,

    I'm sorry if the term irritates you!

    If I was put in charge it would be "haters gonna hate syndrome", but that's not original either...

    Wellington • Since Dec 2007 • 6 posts Report Reply

  • Rich of Observationz, in reply to Kiwiiano,

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Canadian_Flag_Debate

    It was voted in by the parliament after a prolonged controversy. I'd suspect that a factor in its favour would have been that even conservative Quebecois would have favoured a flag change.

    Also, it was a Liberal government - I'd suggest that a government from the left of politics would at least be able to unite its own supporters behind a flag change.

    Back in Wellington • Since Nov 2006 • 5550 posts Report Reply

  • linger, in reply to Richard Mayes,

    None of these terms is as offensive as the cynical deception its use entails. Whichever you choose, you're still ultimately brandishing a piece of shit in a smear campaign. Why keep digging for a fresh turd in that semantic field?

    Tokyo • Since Apr 2007 • 1890 posts Report Reply

First ←Older Page 1 2 3 4 5 Newer→ Last

Post your response…

Please sign in using your Public Address credentials…

Login

You may also create an account or retrieve your password.