Hard News by Russell Brown

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Hard News: Limping Onwards

969 Responses

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  • Jimmy Southgate,

    I'm finding it hard to write what I mean here; but I am wondering if it might be time for this type of Labour Party to end. To me they seem not really committed to an identity or a vision that gives the party a strong reason to exist. Other than being not National.

    Wellingtown • Since Nov 2006 • 100 posts Report Reply

  • Craig Ranapia, in reply to Graeme Edgeler,

    Also important, is avoiding a National Party 2002 result.

    On the bright side, at least Labour here isn't seriously facing the downright sadistic beating voters handed to the New South Wales ALP over the weekend.

    North Shore, Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 12031 posts Report Reply

  • giovanni tiso, in reply to Jimmy Southgate,

    To me they seem not really committed to an identity or a vision that gives the party a strong reason to exist. Other than being not National.

    Being not National is a great reason to exist.

    Wellington • Since Jun 2007 • 7383 posts Report Reply

  • Rik,

    Once again, we have a National Govt making everyone bloody miserable with their policies of slash and burn, and "never mind the promises we made, poor people, you can all get fucked"

    What planet do you live on Jackie?

    Since Jun 2007 • 124 posts Report Reply

  • Craig Ranapia, in reply to Rik,

    What planet do you live on Jackie?

    Dude, I think you've just used your Noob pass. Disagree with Jackie using all your words - make an argument, be pointed and articulate, wit is always a plus.

    North Shore, Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 12031 posts Report Reply

  • Rik,

    Fair point Craig...I was just stunned speechless by the comment! Not actually a noob, just haven't posted in a year or so.

    Since Jun 2007 • 124 posts Report Reply

  • Russell Brown,

    I’ve got to pop out for the rest of the day, but I thought the only point being made is that Laws will concern troll on behalf of nice white middle-class people who look a lot like him, while continuing to void his media bowels all over everyone else. Must be a day ending in Y…

    For perhaps understandable reasons, Laws will generally go easy on scandals involving sex (sorry: "sensuality"). He positively exuded sympathy for Clint Rickards. Although he still manages to shoehorn a nasty little dig at Arie Smith into this one.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 18957 posts Report Reply

  • Danyl Mclauchlan,

    Being not National is a great reason to exist.

    If Labour wants to reposition itself as a conservative party that merely reacts against National policy then they should make a conscious decision to do that, and they can formulate strategy and run an election campaign based on such a platform.
    But I don't think that's how the Goff-lead Labour Party see themselves. I think they're mostly just a collection of individuals who are personally ambitious to be important and powerful, and they understand that they need to be seen to oppose the National government's policies in order to get their jobs.

    Wellington • Since Nov 2006 • 901 posts Report Reply

  • Tristan, in reply to Rich of Observationz,

    I agree with Rich on Tizzard. She has every right to take her place and Labour only have themselves to blame for putting her there. Also Judith might be feeling a little aggrived having given decadeds of service to her party to get absoutly zero public support during the Mt Albert selection and now this. loyalty to a two way street.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 197 posts Report Reply

  • Jackie Clark, in reply to Rik,

    A very beautiful one, where birds sing all day and fairies run the world. Oh, and dogs talk.

    Mt Eden, Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 3123 posts Report Reply

  • Jackie Clark, in reply to Rik,

    What part of the statement are you stunned by, Rik? Have National broken promises in a fairly significant way? Why, yes they have. And do they appear to care about the hoi polloi? Well, no they don't. Not sure how that's outlandish. But each to their own.

    Mt Eden, Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 3123 posts Report Reply

  • Lew Stoddart, in reply to Jackie Clark,

    Jackie, the bit where I get lost is where you blame the swing voters for this state of affairs, rather than the party who failed to lay out these reasonably simple facts & details such that said swing voters would vote for them.

    L

    Wellington, NZ • Since Aug 2010 • 105 posts Report Reply

  • Rich of Observationz,

    If Labour wants to reposition itself as a conservative party that merely reacts against National policy

    **Re-**position?

    [wadja mean I can't embed boldface? Programmer! ]

    Back in Wellington • Since Nov 2006 • 4463 posts Report Reply

  • Che Tibby, in reply to Craig Ranapia,

    at least Labour here isn’t seriously facing the downright sadistic beating voters handed to the New South Wales ALP over the weekend.

    yet. there are many months till the General Election.

    my 2c (again), is a National/Maori coalition, with Labour no-where near in the running.

    Nats might even break 60 seats for the first time.

    the back of an envelope • Since Nov 2006 • 2026 posts Report Reply

  • Danyl Mclauchlan,

    **Re-**position?

    Are KiwiSaver, Working for Families and the Cullen fund the policies of a conservative government?

    Wellington • Since Nov 2006 • 901 posts Report Reply

  • Tristan,

    I also agree with RB Labour gave this legs all week buy not making a full and final decision on day one. ethier sack him or stick by him untill the investigation is complete not this send him on leave, stand him down, sack him in the space of three days stuff. it looked like ameture hour at Bowen house.

    Conor Roberts quit the mayors office they need you in Wellington!

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 197 posts Report Reply

  • Russell Brown, in reply to Tristan,

    Connor Roberts quit the mayors office they need you in Wellington!

    They do, but he'd be a mug to go there right now. I would not be surprised to see him running the campaign after this year's, though.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 18957 posts Report Reply

  • Russell Brown, in reply to Danyl Mclauchlan,

    Are KiwiSaver, Working for Families and the Cullen fund the policies of a conservative government?

    In an old-fashioned way, yeah, sorta.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 18957 posts Report Reply

  • giovanni tiso,

    Yes, they are pretty conservative - enacted by Christian Democrats all over Europe.

    Wellington • Since Jun 2007 • 7383 posts Report Reply

  • Rik,

    Perhaps it is because I would probably not be classed as poor (at this point in time) however I still find raising a young family financially difficult and feel quite justified in receiving a tax cut care of the National government.

    While ideologically I support benefits for those that need them there is ample evidence of many individuals milking the system, and National are brave enough to address the issue.

    Bottom line is there is only so much money to go around. For many years Labour swung the balance towards those you refer to as poor, now National might be swinging things back towards the higher income earners - it all balances out over time. Those on higher incomes bear the lions share of personal income tax revenue - is it such a crime that they get a break every now and again?

    Rather than "fuck the poor" I think National might be saying something more like "fuck any lazy bastard who think the world owes them a living" which is not such a bad thing. Of course - there's always exceptions, and there will always be those in need who require assistance.

    Sounds like we live in similar worlds - it's just that the fairies aren't in charge in my one.

    Since Jun 2007 • 124 posts Report Reply

  • James Butler, in reply to Rik,

    While ideologically I support benefits for those that need them there is ample evidence of many individuals milking the system

    Where?

    Sure there are always people who set out to defraud WINZ and get away with it for too long, but claiming that a) this is a statistically significant problem that b) has a real impact on the bottom line of the budget and c) can only be fixed by kicking the shit out of everyone on a benefit is bullshit.

    Auckland • Since Jan 2009 • 801 posts Report Reply

  • Jimmy Southgate, in reply to Danyl Mclauchlan,

    I think they're mostly just a collection of individuals who are personally ambitious to be important and powerful, and they understand that they need to be seen to oppose the National government's policies in order to get their jobs.

    That's what I meant!!

    Wellingtown • Since Nov 2006 • 100 posts Report Reply

  • James Butler, in reply to Rik,

    Those on higher incomes bear the lions share of personal income tax revenue

    True - so surely if one wants to make real, useful efforts to prevent people "milking the system", which will actually impact government revenue, one should start with corporate tax shenanigans, untaxed capital gains etc. - all systems "milked" by "those on higher incomes", and I'd hazard a guess worth a whole lot more than benefit fraud.

    Auckland • Since Jan 2009 • 801 posts Report Reply

  • Russell Brown, in reply to Rik,

    Sounds like we live in similar worlds – it’s just that the fairies aren’t in charge in my one.

    Which might be a fairer thing to say if you'd cited any facts rather than simply presenting your claims as self-evidently correct.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 18957 posts Report Reply

  • Grant McDougall,

    Labour will keep Goff until after the election. They know that changing horses mid-course just before the 1990 election didn't do them any good then, so it won't now.

    Dunedin • Since Dec 2006 • 612 posts Report Reply

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